"Lenormand Q & A".

[DownUnderNZer]

 

Questions and discussions on anything Lenormand which will hopefully result in answers from different members for all those enthusiasts of this little 36 card deck.

[Trogon]

Okay DownUnderNZer, here's a question. I've been wondering about it for a long time. Tell me what a Lenormand deck is? I know it is 36 cards (in general, that seems to be what I'm seeing). So, it is, of course, smaller than a regular deck of cards. Can someone give me a brief-ish rundown of what it is and how it is usually used?

[DownUnderNZer]

 

 

It is a small deck of 36 cards - like you have said.

 

It usually has a main image on each card and depending on the deck: Words, card inserts, and/or poems.

 

It is read in a straight forward way whereas the Tarot can be read with more intuition and there are different dimensions or layers to the cards.

 

Not that the Lenormand is restricted in anyway because once the basics or core meanings are down packed - the sky is the limit.

 

Cannot insert images to give you an idea of a workable spread.

 

EXAMPLE:

 

Joe wants to know if Jill is into the idea of a future with him after being together for almost a year.

 

HEART + CLOUDS + ANCHOR

 

 

Heart = Love, Feelings, Emotions

Clouds = Confusion, Despair, Uncertainty.

Anchor = Stable, Dependable, Long term.

 

 

In this situation it shows that Jill doesn't quite have clarity on what is between her and Jim emotionally (Heart + Clouds) and  is uncertain about how she feels (Clouds), but this will sort itself out and she will eventually be committed to a future with him. (Anchor).

 

 

It can be that direct and to the point.

 

 

Hope that answers your question.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Little Fang]

I have a couple of Lenormand decks I keep trying to use before I give up.  I have the most trouble trying not to go all deep and intuitive into what the card is.  Do you have any tips on how to keep the tarot mind out of picture?

[DownUnderNZer]

 

 

The Lenormand uses its own system really and the meanings are not quite in the same stead as the Tarot.

 

MOON and TOWER are not the same at all except MOON can be about emotions (deep) depending on the question.

 

Best to keep Tarot and Lenormand seperate or you will confuse yourself.

 

Keep in mind that the Lenormand are to the point and as you see them really and meant to be read as a combo not singular one by one.

 

I would stay away from count downs and base cards and focus on the core meanings of one system like the French or German.

 

No intuitive methods until you have it down packed and can work intuitively with in the meanings.

 

 

I have a couple of Lenormand decks I keep trying to use before I give up.  I have the most trouble trying not to go all deep and intuitive into what the card is.  Do you have any tips on how to keep the tarot mind out of picture?

[Trogon]

Thanks DownUnderNZer! That did answer my question very well. And I appreciate your taking the time to start the thread, it was a big help.

[Lantana]

I have a couple of Lenormand decks I keep trying to use before I give up.  I have the most trouble trying not to go all deep and intuitive into what the card is.  Do you have any tips on how to keep the tarot mind out of picture?

 

I see it like this: Tarot is imagery based, while Lenormand is word based. When first starting out I'd say it's best to ignore the pictures entirely, since we're so used to getting intuitive blips from the images in tarot, and just focus on the words and what they mean and forming sentences mentioned above. That's what has helped me detach from my tarot mind, anyway.

[DownUnderNZer]

 

 

Lantana does have a valid point.

 

 

However, I was taught Lenormand years before the Tarot, and with a deck called THE BLUE OWL that had no poems or words just card insets and numbering.

 

It is the deck I still use although I have quite a few others now.

 

Some Lenormand decks do not have words on them and it is those decks that I think are IDEAL. No distractions and you can work with the meaning of the symbol/image or what number relates to the symbol/image.

 

Even some antique decks I own are not really reader friendly as I have come to realize trying them out. Some are absolutely hard work.

 

I think the newest ones I like in order that I do own and are excellent to work with are:

 

1) One Minute Lenormand. (OOP) (LE)

2) Gilded Reverie.

 

 

Because of the following:

 

1) A clear decent sized symbol/image on it.  Eg Tower/Dog/House.

2) No word poems.

3) Numbers.

 

However, the GILDED REVERIE is not true to form in some ways as has its own words on one or two cards like Card 22.  The art work though is truly phenomenal and therefore if anyone is looking for colors, originality, and something readable this is one deck I think worthy of a mention. Just a tad concerned that the words that are different may confuse some especially if they come across others saying Card 22 is Crossroads or Pathway.

 

Besides BLUE OWL though, for me, THE MINUTE LENORMAND is ONE modern deck out there that checks all the boxes for me and it is a shame that Hollister (think that is the correct maker) only made so many of them.

 

I am so glad I own two of them and they will remain boxed and stored away forever I'd say. Truly outstanding deck and especially if you like colors, something easy to read, loud numbers, and no poems, plus the symbols/images stand out very clear.

 

 

About learning though....

 

 

I think it is better to not cross over or back and forth between the Tarot and Lenormand when learning and to remember that the Lenormand uses its own system and that MOON and TOWER have their own meanings that are not like the Tarot except that MOON can mean deep emotions and that is about it for similarities.

 

 

DND  :)

 

 

 

I have a couple of Lenormand decks I keep trying to use before I give up.  I have the most trouble trying not to go all deep and intuitive into what the card is.  Do you have any tips on how to keep the tarot mind out of picture?

 

I see it like this: Tarot is imagery based, while Lenormand is word based. When first starting out I'd say it's best to ignore the pictures entirely, since we're so used to getting intuitive blips from the images in tarot, and just focus on the words and what they mean and forming sentences mentioned above. That's what has helped me detach from my tarot mind, anyway.

[chongjasmine]

What books of lenormand do you recommend for beginners?

[DownUnderNZer]

 

 

I did not learn from books to start with as there were none in English, but when I chose to go in a different direction I did buy:

 

THE SECRETS OF THE LENORMAND ORACLE  (Sylvie Steinbach).

 

 

I wanted to learn a freer style of reading that was not the GT.

 

So, this was brilliant for me although it took time and questions - for many others it was totally confusing.  It is great for combinations, but not all combos are explained for the various meanings that could connect to each one.

 

There are other books out now like the one written by Rana George. This one seems to be quite popular. Looking at it on Amazon I thought it "waffled" a bit with her personal stories, but some seem to like that personal touch. Also, I did see her do a partial reading on YouTube and it was not too bad although more would have been better to see so as to get a better feel of how she reads.

 

There is another book (or two) out by Caitlin Matthews only that one I am not in favor of nor her deck really. I have her deck & book set. Also, I saw some of the main book she wrote and either something was out of place or not connected to the right page.

 

A few more exist now if you are looking for one in English.

 

In German and French it is a bit more extensive I believe.

 

 

DND  :)

 

 

What books of lenormand do you recommend for beginners?

[EmpyreanKnight]

What do you think about the newly published Lenormand decks that have a lot of extra cards, like the Expanded 47-Card Edition of the Gilded Reverie Lenormand or the Maybe Lenormand? Would you take them as they are and use them the way the creator meant them to be used or would you just discard the extra cards and keep the original 36?

 

Also, it's too bad that you don't like Caitlin Matthews's The Complete Lenormand Oracle Handbook. Could the disconnect be because you both follow different Lenormand schools?

[DownUnderNZer]

 

 

I am getting the extended version of the Gilded Reverie, but would only use the extra MEN and WOMEN cards I think or just keep it to collect.

 

Will decide when I see it face to face.

 

As for Matthews, it could be because of learning different systems, but when I learnt I was thrown in the deep end with the French and German systems at the same time. The Dutch system is not really that different as it seems to be a combination of both only the "Snake" is not seen as "the other woman" by some and the "Moon" is the core card for work.

 

Having said that - systems cross over it seems and some use a combination of systems at the same time so it is not really "pure".

 

Whatever I saw in her book at the time seemed "off", so it could have been to do with different systems, or just that it was not the right write up for the image perhaps.

 

 

 

 

DND  :)

 

 

 

 

 

What do you think about the newly published Lenormand decks that have a lot of extra cards, like the Expanded 47-Card Edition of the Gilded Reverie Lenormand or the Maybe Lenormand? Would you take them as they are and use them the way the creator meant them to be used or would you just discard the extra cards and keep the original 36?

 

Also, it's too bad that you don't like Caitlin Matthews's The Complete Lenormand Oracle Handbook. Could the disconnect be because you both follow different Lenormand schools?

[DownUnderNZer]

In depth versus Limited

 

 

I was looking up Lenormand Spreads on YouTube in the early hours of this morning and discovered after an hour or so a few videos uploaded by Rana George.

 

Only saw a snippet of her a few years back, so was quite thrilled to stumble across these I must say as some seem quite current.

 

 

All I will say is, after watching about 3 or 4, it made me wonder about "in depth" versus "limited" details and the importance of "positions of cards" and/or "combinations" plus the "choice of spreads" and "meanings" given.

 

 

I am wondering how close to her book does she read face to face when it comes to the meanings of cards. E.g. Key. Also, how we as Lenormand readers (even Tarot or Oracle) read face to face, as in do we leave out in depth details and stay with the core meanings only or what we associate the card to mean connected to the question in one or two words.

 

 

ONE VIDEO by Rana George.  (Link below).

 

 

Rana George mentions "Key" (over one's head) as meaning: "Strength to have anybody" and that it "holds a lot of power" and I think "Clover" is only referenced as "she gets what she wants".

 

 

With the first part of the "H Spread" used in this video by Rana George which has the KEY/WOMAN/BEAR it is about "what is important and needs to focused on right now" in order to "attract what is to come" which is the second part of the spread.

 

 

She states it is "important" (Key) for Stacey to focus on being strong (Bear).

 

 

I do agree with this, but is there more to it that just a basic break down of those two cards when there is more in depth information to them both? Do we as readers resort to basics on the whole when reading in person compared to how we would do it in written form? Do we leave out information only not on purpose?

 

 

It really makes me think.

 

 

"Key" could be about a turning point in Stacy's life or a major life event happening which will impact on her in a significant way and "Bear" could be about her needing to deal with being "in control", "being over bearing","over protective" and/or "too motherly".

 

 

That is what I see when looking at those two cards, but is it what I would see if I was doing it face to face?

 

 

Perhaps it would be as it is not like I needed to look the information up at all and it is what came to mind straight off the bat.

 

 

Having said that.....

 

 

1) Do we as Lenormand readers, when doing face to face readings, only give basic limited information rather than in depth insight whether experienced or not - even if we know there is in depth details to a card?

 

2) Does it depend on what we know or whether Traditionally taught or more Modern?

 

 

 

 

 

LINK:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I did not learn from books to start with as there were none in English, but when I chose to go in a different direction I did buy:

 

THE SECRETS OF THE LENORMAND ORACLE  (Sylvie Steinbach).

 

 

I wanted to learn a freer style of reading that was not the GT.

 

So, this was brilliant for me although it took time and questions - for many others it was totally confusing.  It is great for combinations, but not all combos are explained for the various meanings that could connect to each one.

 

There are other books out now like the one written by Rana George. This one seems to be quite popular. Looking at it on Amazon I thought it "waffled" a bit with her personal stories, but some seem to like that personal touch. Also, I did see her do a partial reading on YouTube and it was not too bad although more would have been better to see so as to get a better feel of how she reads.

 

There is another book (or two) out by Caitlin Matthews only that one I am not in favor of nor her deck really. I have her deck & book set. Also, I saw some of the main book she wrote and either something was out of place or not connected to the right page.

 

A few more exist now if you are looking for one in English.

 

In German and French it is a bit more extensive I believe.

 

 

DND  :)

 

 

What books of lenormand do you recommend for beginners?

[EmpyreanKnight]

Aside from Matthews's book, do you know of other books, teachers, and online resources that teach the Dutch system?

 

What system do you personally prefer and follow, and what books and resources would you recommend to anyone who wants to learn it?

[EmpyreanKnight]

And btw, we truly appreciate the wealth of knowledge you that share in this thread, especially to Lenormand noobs like me. Thanks a lot!

[DownUnderNZer]

I only opened these topics to kick start them really.

 

 

Andy Boroshevengra stems from the Dutch tradition as well and has a book or two out. Traditional, but not tied to it. His meanings can be quite heavy which I feel connects to traditionalists. I recall some of what he shared on AT in regards to meanings and opinions, so this is what I am going by. However, until June this year, I always thought he was German.

 

 

If you want the core basic meanings and a historical perspective then Anthony Louis (German meanings) is the go to for that type of valid insight. He even gives alternative meanings and touches on the playing cards associations like Hearts, Clubs, Spades, and Diamonds etc. Excellent resource!

 

I did get Louis's book as it was recommended by Mary Greer only I have not really looked at it that much.

 

I did not learn from books when I first learnt the Lenormand nor did I have any resources available to me except two German women and they let me sink or swim by throwing me in the deep end with the GT as my teething ring.

 

I think the first time I ever saw the Lenormand was around 2002 or 2003, but it took me a little while to warm up to them so it was a few years before I really really started paying attention and I learnt the hard way due to no resources and limitations with language. It was kind of relatively easy for me though like a duck taking to water - I got it whereas some just did not!

 

One of the women followed the French system and the other was traditional German. I mostly went with the second one back then even though her English was really bad because she could see things like past lives and future. Even death. More advanced and strict with her methods.

 

When I chose to branch out and try something in a more freer style I went with Sylvie Steinbach as her book was the only book available in English.

 

 

Her style was the transition I needed.

 

 

Rana George's book seems to be popular although I found it rambled on when I viewed it on Amazon. I do not own a copy.

 

 

Nowadays, I like the French system more and more compared to the German as it is not as heavy.

 

 

Best of luck!

 

 

DND  ;D

 

 

 

Aside from Matthews's book, do you know of other books, teachers, and online resources that teach the Dutch system?

 

What system do you personally prefer and follow, and what books and resources would you recommend to anyone who wants to learn it?

[littleredcourgette]

I hope this is the right place for the question:

 

If you ask a question using the GT - e.g. how can i improve my relationship with a specific person - do you then view every single card and position as an answer to that question? So if it looked like the cards were saying "a new job is on the horizon and will be prosperous" would you link that to love or view it separately?

[DownUnderNZer]

 

There are areas that you can look at as a whole at the same time; like: Career, Travel, Health, Relationships, Children, and Money etc.

 

This would come under a General and/or Overview of those areas.

 

However, as you've asked something to the point like:

 

How can i improve my relationship with a specific person?

 

I would just be focusing on that and not going off on something else like a career unless it comes up flanking or crossing the MAN or WOMAN for some reason.

 

EXAMPLES:

 

A) German: MAN is on ANCHOR or next to it, so right now his focus is work related.

B) French: FOX is above WOMAN so there is something happening in her job that is not in her control.

C) German: ANCHOR is on RIDER so currently there is news or a message in connection to his/her career.

 

If main focus or topic cards like Fox (French) or Anchor (German) are nowhere near the MAN or WOMAN, their houses, or cross their paths in some way then I would not venture in to that territory at all.

 

Also, not every single card, but it is important to pay attention to the whole GT so you do not miss anything.

 

Look at where the MAN and WOMAN are as well as RING and HEART. The cards that surround them, knighting, mirroring, corners, windows, boxes etc. What is relevant to the situation.

 

Again, not every single card though as it is unlikely to be necessary.

 

DND  :)

 

I hope this is the right place for the question:

 

If you ask a question using the GT - e.g. how can i improve my relationship with a specific person - do you then view every single card and position as an answer to that question? So if it looked like the cards were saying "a new job is on the horizon and will be prosperous" would you link that to love or view it separately?

[littleredcourgette]

Wow. Thanks very much for taking the time to write that. I just have one additional question - which is more important? The house that the heart is in (and a reading of the combination of the two) or the whichever card sits in the house of the heart? For example if my heart card is in the house 'clover' then I might read that favourably but if, within the same tableau, the card "Mice" sits in the heart house then I wouldn't be feeling so positive.

[DownUnderNZer]

 

Depends on how you choose to read. Some do not use the houses at all.

 

I would follow the Heart and Ring plus Man and Woman.

 

For example, if Heart was on Clover I would also see where Clover is and then maybe the next card or so onward and if Mice is on Heart I would look to see what is on the house of Mice as well and so forth. The cards that surround those cards impact as well and quite strongly.

 

So, what is next to Heart on both sides and what is next to Mice?

 

Mice on Heart could just mean nervous excitement and that the relationship and/or emotional side to it is under stress.

 

Mice is never really a good card to see though as it does usually tend to mean that something is deteriorating bit by bit. Not quite dead, but slowly and surely falling apart.

 

However...

 

It is important to look at everything that connects to get a full picture.

 

 

Wow. Thanks very much for taking the time to write that. I just have one additional question - which is more important? The house that the heart is in (and a reading of the combination of the two) or the whichever card sits in the house of the heart? For example if my heart card is in the house 'clover' then I might read that favourably but if, within the same tableau, the card "Mice" sits in the heart house then I wouldn't be feeling so positive.