Irrelevant cards?

[RatLuv]

Hi,

 

I'm new to Tarot but am not having very good results at all. I really don't understand how the cards I pull have any significance to what I asked!

 

Two examples, one silly, one serious. The silly one: "What kind of thing shall I have for dinner tomorrow?" I got The Lovers (love, relationships, union) - how does that answer my question? The serious one: "What should I look out for this coming winter, especially regarding the coronavirus?" I got King Of Swords - being intelligent and analytical. It just doesn't make sense to me.

 

Do you ever get any cards that don't even begin to answer your query? And if you do, do you just draw again?

thanks

[vulprix]

2 hours ago, RatLuv said:

Hi,

 

I'm new to Tarot but am not having very good results at all. I really don't understand how the cards I pull have any significance to what I asked!

 

Two examples, one silly, one serious. The silly one: "What kind of thing shall I have for dinner tomorrow?" I got The Lovers (love, relationships, union) - how does that answer my question? The serious one: "What should I look out for this coming winter, especially regarding the coronavirus?" I got King Of Swords - being intelligent and analytical. It just doesn't make sense to me.

 

Do you ever get any cards that don't even begin to answer your query? And if you do, do you just draw again?

thanks

Hi RatLuv!

 

I think the first step might be to consider how the card meaning might apply to your situation. So, if you pull The Lovers regarding your future dinner, think: choice, connection, symbiosis. Something that you really decide on which really jams with you. And depending on your deck and your intuition, space out a bit. Does a texture or image in the card LOOK like a food to you?

 

Your question was pretty silly, but there are ways to understand seemingly incongruous cards in the context of your question.

 

What should you look out for this winter re: coronavirus being King of Swords is a lot heavier, but you can contextualize this card in a similar way. The King of Swords is a court card of a sharp, exacting nature. Will a domineering figure, maybe someone who is an Air sign, give you wrong direction or wrong orders that put your health in danger? Or will they actually be there to help you discern what you can do to protect yourself? Are you maybe the King of Swords figure yourself?

 

I hope that this gives some insight into contextualizing tarot cards. There are many books that would serve you well with deeper methods of interpretation, like Rachel Pollack’s 78 Degrees of Wisdom and Tarot: The Open Reading by Yoav Ben Dov (just to name two of my favorites).

[katrinka]

2 hours ago, RatLuv said:

I'm new to Tarot but am not having very good results at all. I really don't understand how the cards I pull have any significance to what I asked!

You just need to put them in the context of the question. Context is everything when it comes to reading cards, but most books fail to explain it! So a lot of people have this same issue.

2 hours ago, RatLuv said:

Two examples, one silly, one serious. The silly one: "What kind of thing shall I have for dinner tomorrow?" I got The Lovers (love, relationships, union) - how does that answer my question?

Easy. Let's look at Lovers meanings: a lot of people interpret it as a choice. This choice requires you to make a clear decision. It can stand for fulfilling a wish or desire. Think of throwing caution to the winds and beginning a torrid love affair with someone you've been strongly attracted to for a long time.

Now ramp that down. Your "attraction" might simply be craving. What is it you've been wanting for dinner? There's your answer.

2 hours ago, RatLuv said:

The serious one: "What should I look out for this coming winter, especially regarding the coronavirus?" I got King Of Swords - being intelligent and analytical. It just doesn't make sense to me.

The King of Swords like intellectual sparring. Since you asked what to look out for, I'd use the more negative angles for this card and take extra precaution to avoid mind games like bogus news sites and statements. Don't assume anything will prevent it completely (Putin and his claim to have a vaccine are a good example of the KS gone bad.) Stay away from people who buy into quack conspiracy theories and refuse to mask up.

2 hours ago, RatLuv said:

Do you ever get any cards that don't even begin to answer your query? And if you do, do you just draw again?

Never. The answers are already there on the table, we just have to puzzle it out.
Another thing to avoid is "clarification cards". If you're having trouble already, adding more cards certainly doesn't clarify anything!
Hope this helps. 😉

[DanielJUK]

Sometimes with tarot you have to think a bit outside the box when you use it and think of all possible perspectives. Look at the card art, it often has a clue like food for dinner.

 

The Lovers is the food you love and are most harmonious with, you should have your fave food whatever it is! Treat yourself to the dinner you are most connected with personally 🙂

 

The King of Swords is often a medical Doctor or consultant or surgeon as a person, they look for evidence before diagnosis. But in your question, think of this card as a judge. A Judge is supposed to be impartial in a court case, they rise above emotions and their personal view. They look for evidence and facts ONLY. You might FEEL (emotions) that there will be an awful second wave or something negative (I think we all fear something like that) but this card says you should only base things on facts and published medical / science evidence. This says to me follow medical and scientific experts, not conspiracy rumours on whatsapp or social networks. You should look out for being objective and detached this coming Winter, look for evidence and facts behind everything! Think you have symptoms? get a test for example, don't worry over something without evidence.

 

As you learn tarot, it's useful to have a basic idea of each card. For example for your reading, Lovers for me is a harmonious mutual connection, a union of values so taking that to your question, it;s the dinner you love and feel most connected with. My memorised KofS is this Judge idea, they are into logic, facts, evidence but control / repress their emotions and a great thinker so that is how I took it to your Winter reading. No card is irreverent, it's the right card for a message for you but you just have to decode the message 🙂As you explore the cards, think what is the basic idea of each card, what is it saying? It will really help you in future 🙂

Edited August 25, 2020 by DanielJUK

[katrinka]

26 minutes ago, DanielJUK said:

The King of Swords is often a medical Doctor or consultant or surgeon as a person, they look for evidence before diagnosis. But in your question, think of this card as a judge. A Judge is supposed to be impartial in a court case, they rise above emotions and their personal view. They look for evidence and facts ONLY. You might FEEL (emotions) that there will be an awful second wave or something negative (I think we all fear something like that) but this card says you should only base things on facts and published medical / science evidence. This says to me follow medical and scientific experts, not conspiracy rumours on whatsapp or social networks. You should look out for being objective and detached this coming Winter, look for evidence and facts behind everything!

It looks like we took different roads on that one, but ended up at the same place. 😁
I totally agree. Science and peer-reviewed studies are the way to go with this.

[RatLuv]

These are all AMAZING responses, thanks so much! 

 

Really hadn't considered half of what you've mentioned...but it sounds great.

[LogicalHue]

On 8/24/2020 at 6:37 PM, RatLuv said:

Do you ever get any cards that don't even begin to answer your query? And if you do, do you just draw again?

I wouldn't in the context of "I didn't like that answer, give me a different one" but I do draw a lot of what I refer to as "clarifying cards". I generally do 3 card draws and while that's often a nice complete sentiment, sometimes I'm not totally clear. Perhaps I'll draw more cards for just one of the cards, or maybe for the whole reading. I think of them as an expansion on the answer, not a replacement or new answer. Personally I've settled on re-shuffling for clarifiers and thinking about what I got and what I'm not clear on, and maybe ideas of what I think it might be but can't decide between. I used to just pull them off the top as, I believe, that was what I was told to do. I've also heard of people getting them from the bottom of the deck.

 

I should also mention that when I'm pulling clarifiers I have to have the right mindset. My deck and I are having a conversation, and that conversation just isn't over yet. If I feel anxious or frustrated or like "I'm just not getting it" then its not going to work out. I'll get complete nonsense or my deck will get fed up with me.

[AlbaTross]

I find the cards don't respond to me the way I like when I ask them something I'm not really feeling.  I tried asking silly questions, and got nonsense answers too.  I believe I drew things like Justice and Judgement in response to "should I get a PS5 when it comes out or wait for a bit?"  I think I also drew the Five of Wands or something with serious connotations of conflict.  

 

Also, when I've tried to ask my cards for psychic insight into things that don't involve me such as what a former friend of mine who cut ties with me might be thinking, or what I'll think of the results of the US election, I tend to get responses from the cards that say "let's talk about you".  In the above cases, I essentially got cards saying "there are regrets but you really need to get over them and it's time to begin a new journey without that friend", and "maybe you should reevaluate where you're spending your time and thoughts" respectively.  What this all appears to mean is, there are either things that make for better questions to ask the cards, or it's important to feel the question being asked, or some combination of both (which is what I highly suspect).  

[katrinka]

On 9/1/2020 at 12:19 AM, AlbaTross said:

I find the cards don't respond to me the way I like when I ask them something I'm not really feeling.  I tried asking silly questions, and got nonsense answers too.  I believe I drew things like Justice and Judgement in response to "should I get a PS5 when it comes out or wait for a bit?"  I think I also drew the Five of Wands or something with serious connotations of conflict.  

That's not really a silly question. It won't be cheap and you're probably wondering if the use and enjoyment you'd get from it justifies the price.
Justice could be talking about weighing your options, 5 of Wands could be referring to a game. The draw is always relevant, you just have to put it in context.

On 9/1/2020 at 12:19 AM, AlbaTross said:

Also, when I've tried to ask my cards for psychic insight into things that don't involve me such as what a former friend of mine who cut ties with me might be thinking, or what I'll think of the results of the US election, I tend to get responses from the cards that say "let's talk about you".  In the above cases, I essentially got cards saying "there are regrets but you really need to get over them and it's time to begin a new journey without that friend", and "maybe you should reevaluate where you're spending your time and thoughts" respectively.  What this all appears to mean is, there are either things that make for better questions to ask the cards, or it's important to feel the question being asked, or some combination of both (which is what I highly suspect).  

I never get responses like "let's talk about you". Ack! That must be annoying.
It sounds like an issue with the meanings you're using, to be honest. From the 70's  80's on, there's been a push to paint the Tarot as more psychological, less predictive. So people who use these meanings get something that comes off like a counseling session. But someone who has lost their keys doesn't need that, they need to find their keys. You can totally avoid the Dr. Phil stuff with older sources. Virtually anything from the 60's or before.

I'm not saying all contemporary writers are pushing that stuff. But it's a lot more common than it ought to be.

[Guest]

There are a couple of things, here.
 

Generally speaking, irrelevant cards are indicative of fixed  over reliance on “meanings” - such as love, relationships and union for the Lovers’ card. Such meanings presuppose a context which, even if correct, fails to consider individual circumstances and other variables. You asked about a meal — what dishes or ingredient go together well, cognac and Dijon,&c? With the King of Swords, look out for the sick man. Kings are men and swords are the suit of sickness —keep your distance. 
 

The other thing is cards talk to each other. Consider utilising two or three. One card readings, although popular, are often more an exercise in creative writing than card reading.

[AlbaTross]

16 hours ago, katrinka said:

That's not really a silly question. It won't be cheap and you're probably wondering if the use and enjoyment you'd get from it justifies the price.
Justice could be talking about weighing your options, 5 of Wands could be referring to a game. The draw is always relevant, you just have to put it in context.

I never get responses like "let's talk about you". Ack! That must be annoying.
It sounds like an issue with the meanings you're using, to be honest. From the 70's  80's on, there's been a push to paint the Tarot as more psychological, less predictive. So people who use these meanings get something that comes off like a counseling session. But someone who has lost their keys doesn't need that, they need to find their keys. You can totally avoid the Dr. Phil stuff with older sources. Virtually anything from the 60's or before.

I'm not saying all contemporary writers are pushing that stuff. But it's a lot more common than it ought to be.

And here I was thinking that was a sign that I shouldn't be using the cards that way.  I'm not entirely sure where I stand yet in regards to the cards being divination vs them being purely psychological, especially with my religious background, but I figured what I have is either evidence that the cards are psychological and what I experienced was the natural consequence of trying to read into things I couldn't otherwise know, or evidence of the notion that decks have personalities and mine is a little bit snarky. 

 

I can try and look into older material though.  I do have The Pictoral Key to the Tarot by Arthur Wait, though it only really goes into a bit more depth with the Major Arcana while the Minor Arcana come with the exact same description I get with the manual that comes with my traditional RWS deck.  Curiously enough, this guide is useful as that manual kind of skims over the Major Arcana meanings for some reason.  At the stage I'm at though, I've found I prefer sources that are in a more modern dialect, and with more of a description, such as the Biddy Tarot website (which is undoubtedly a modern source).  Maybe I'll get to the point where I can work with less (and can fully comprehend the turn of the 20th century, British academic dialect) and can follow my intuition more, but I might be a ways off on that.  

 

For what it's worth, I probably wouldn't have readily accepted the readings at face value in both instances if they hadn't both been eerily salient.  What the cards said about me were spot on.  I probably wouldn't have felt better knowing what my former friend was thinking at that moment, and I knew that moving on would be for the best, even if it would be difficult (and it has been).  There is also little reason for me to read into the politics of that infernal country that I don't even live in, even if I'd love for them to send the orange ape packing, as I am fretting over the possibility of him getting a second term far more than I should be for someone whose life he has no sway over.  The cards were right that I should spend my time and thoughts elsewhere.  

Edited September 4, 2020 by AlbaTross

[katrinka]

27 minutes ago, AlbaTross said:

And here I was thinking that was a sign that I shouldn't be using the cards that way.  I'm not entirely sure where I stand yet in regards to the cards being divination vs them being purely psychological, especially with my religious background, but I figured what I have is either evidence that the cards are psychological and what I experienced was the natural consequence of trying to read into things I couldn't otherwise know, or evidence of the notion that decks have personalities and mine is a little bit snarky. 

I wouldn't split it into an either/or of divination vs. purely psychological. "Divination" is rooted in the word "divine" and implies that deities/higher beings  are feeding you answers. Some religions have such beings, and my usual approach is to think of them in terms of how they exist rather than if they exist. Part of that is that  they're wired into our minds. The "vs." becomes moot.

But I prefer not to dwell any of that. It's all fortunetelling to me. I think of it kind of like a translation service. Cards are a language. 😉

27 minutes ago, AlbaTross said:

There is also little reason for me to read into the politics of that infernal country that I don't even live in, even if I'd love for them to send the orange ape packing, as I am fretting over the possibility of him getting a second term far more than I should be for someone whose life he has no sway over.  The cards were right that I should spend my time and thoughts elsewhere.  

I wouldn't be too sure of that. Things that happen in one part of the world have a way of affecting people in other places. Usually not in a good way. I hope he's voted out and paraded up and down Pennsylvania Avenue in a little cage on wheels. Better still if it's pulled by Hillary Clinton on a Harley.

[AlbaTross]

11 minutes ago, katrinka said:

I wouldn't split it into an either/or of divination vs. purely psychological. "Divination" is rooted in the word "divine" and implies that deities/higher beings  are feeding you answers. Some religions have such beings, and my usual approach is to think of them in terms of how they exist rather than if they exist. Part of that is that  they're wired into our minds. The "vs." becomes moot.

But I prefer not to dwell any of that. It's all fortunetelling to me. I think of it kind of like a translation service. Cards are a language. 😉

I wouldn't be too sure of that. Things that happen in one part of the world have a way of affecting people in other places. Usually not in a good way. I hope he's voted out and paraded up and down Pennsylvania Avenue in a little cage on wheels. Better still if it's pulled by Hillary Clinton on a Harley.

That's a good way of thinking about God.  I found out it is debatable whether the biblical stance against divination is actually rooted in New Covenant too, so there's that.  

 

I was thinking I'd love for the Cheeto Man to be rolled out of the White House by Oompa Loompas (the orange ones from the 1960s original film).  It would be a total waste of taxpayer dollers but it would be a good waste.  Realistically speaking though, I'll settle for footage of him being dragged out of the White House by the military.  It will probably only show him being escorted out from the front lawn, but it will be worth it.  I sincerely hope that everyone here who lives in the US intends to vote.  

[katrinka]

I'd walk barefoot through salted broken glass all the way to the polling place if I had to. It's that important.
Mark noon EST January 20th on your calendar. If Biden wins (KNOCK. WOOD.), that's the moment that the Secret Service is working for HIM, not Trump. Squatters will be ejected, and then the indictment cannon starts firing...(I was looking for a popcorn gif to insert here, but none expressed the appropriate levels of glee and elation.)

And I can picture the Oompa Loompas: "WE'RE TAKING ORANGE BACK!" 😁 Orange has become kind of tainted. Just the other night I was looking at my Etsy profile pic and worrying that the orange dress I was wearing could be misinterpreted. 🙄

Apologies for the mods for talking politics. I know we aren't supposed to. I guess I feel safe saying these things because at this point, even a lot of lifelong republicans are in agreement. It's THAT bad.

OK, back to cards.

[AlbaTross]

2 hours ago, katrinka said:

I'd walk barefoot through salted broken glass all the way to the polling place if I had to. It's that important.
Mark noon EST January 20th on your calendar. If Biden wins (KNOCK. WOOD.), that's the moment that the Secret Service is working for HIM, not Trump. Squatters will be ejected, and then the indictment cannon starts firing...(I was looking for a popcorn gif to insert here, but none expressed the appropriate levels of glee and elation.)

And I can picture the Oompa Loompas: "WE'RE TAKING ORANGE BACK!" 😁 Orange has become kind of tainted. Just the other night I was looking at my Etsy profile pic and worrying that the orange dress I was wearing could be misinterpreted. 🙄

Apologies for the mods for talking politics. I know we aren't supposed to. I guess I feel safe saying these things because at this point, even a lot of lifelong republicans are in agreement. It's THAT bad.

OK, back to cards.

Yes, let's return to cards.  They don't stress me out.