3 of swords

[RosieBlack]

So I know this card is generally related to heartbreak, break ups, difficulties in relationships etc. But given that it's a swords card it has me a bit confused. Swords deal with mental/intellectual aspects, while cups deal with emotions. Therefore, I'd expect to see a card about heartbreak to be in the cups suit more than with the swords suit. What is your take on this card? Do you think it relates more to the mental aspects of heartbreak, like when your mind is racing and you can't stop thinking about someone/something? Or do you think that regardless of the suit, it can still relate to heartbreak on an emotional level?

[malvina]

I read the Swords in a more cartomantic way, as a suit of troubles. The nearby cards can tell whether the issue is more of emotional, financial, physical, etc. nature. I don’t see 3 of Swords or even the keyword “heartbreak” as relating only to love and relationships. Here’re three approaches shared by James Revak:

 

WAITE: Removal, absence, delay, division, rupture, dispersion, and all that the design signifies [see illustration, left] naturally, being too simple and obvious to call for specific enumeration. Additional Meanings: For a woman, the flight of her lover.

 

MATHERS: Nun, Separation, Removal, Rupture, Quarrel. 

 

ETTEILLA: Estrangement [Removal], Departure, Absence, Gap, Dispersion, Remote, Delay.—Scorn, Repugnance, Aversion, Hate, Disgust, Horror.—Incompatibility, Annoyance, Opposition, Unsociableness, Misanthropy, Rudeness.—Separation, Division, Rupture, Antipathy, Part, Cut. 

[Guest]

3S is certainly one of the most dramatic visuals in the RWS deck. I don't like seeing it if I'm reading for myself!  As a 3, though, it is interesting to view it in relation to the other 3's in the deck. Cups and Pentacles are about building, community, togetherness. Wands is about pause, reflection, but also an idea of planning and manifesting. What could that mean for the 3 of swords?

 

I also read somewhere that 3S is more about temporary, passing pain. 

I like the notion also of it being a bit more literal; cutting to the 'heart' of a matter. 

[AJ-ish/Sharyn]

Product of his times...

 

I drew the 3 of Swords today, I chose to see it as memory of a friend gone, not the actual loss which has softened with time. Swords have two sides. 

[Eric13]

I think the 3/S's is also a card that depends on its surrounding cards as well.

It can also represent sorrow. 

Either a current, a happening around the sitter, and a flow of the natural order of the sitter. As in what their going through about why they came for a reading; and what will happen to them in that relation. Of course, there's also a secrecy behind it all, whether its curved swords through roses, or a heart in front of clouds, there's an underlying secret somewhere having a cause/effect relationship.

It is a deep card.

[katrinka]

On 9/29/2021 at 11:53 AM, malvina said:

I read the Swords in a more cartomantic way, as a suit of troubles. The nearby cards can tell whether the issue is more of emotional, financial, physical, etc. nature. I don’t see 3 of Swords or even the keyword “heartbreak” as relating only to love and relationships.

 

Agree. I would apply "intellect" more to the courts, and not always even then. If you look at the RWS, the 1-10S aren't really about intellect. A few may depict people employing strategies, but the same could be said of some of the Wands cards. The 3S is pretty self explanatory - the clouds and rain, the pierced heart. And it's certainly not just applicable to love and relationships. People can be hurt, depressed, or disappointed by other things.

 

3 hours ago, TheThumbPuppy said:

I wonder why Waite singled out women?

 

I probably know of as many women as men to stray, despite popular culture.

 

It's more socially accepted now. Of course, it still happened then, but it was generally frowned on. Most likely because reliable birth control hadn't been invented yet, and men were generally the sole breadwinners. So there were the practical considerations of not wanting to be tricked into supporting another man's child, and not wanting to be thought of as a woman who might do something like that.

There is also the fact that Waite was a bit of a pompous @ss. 😁
 

[Guest]

6 hours ago, TheThumbPuppy said:

 

I wonder why Waite singled out women?

 

I probably know of as many women as men to stray, despite popular culture.

Agree, that struck me too! Product of the times I guess. 

[WaltQuan]

Elliot Adam, in Fearless Tarot

 

suggests that the three of swords is about forgiveness...   (being less about them and more about you, who are receiving the card/message) - it was first card in a reading I did yesterday where someone had asked about 'forgiveness'

 

gosh the cards can be right on!

 

walter
victoria bc

[Guest]

On 10/29/2021 at 10:17 PM, WaltQuan said:

Elliot Adam, in Fearless Tarot

 

suggests that the three of swords is about forgiveness...   (being less about them and more about you, who are receiving the card/message) - it was first card in a reading I did yesterday where someone had asked about 'forgiveness'

 

gosh the cards can be right on!

 

walter
victoria bc

Oh that's interesting! Could you explain that a bit more? What is it about the card that suggests forgiveness? 

[WaltQuan]

38 minutes ago, lastlight said:

Oh that's interesting! Could you explain that a bit more? What is it about the card that suggests forgiveness? 

 

'i don't have his book with me at the moment but i think it goes something on the lines of:

 

if this is all a process of moving forward (rather than being stuck in the energy that the card describes), then the only way to truly go forward after betrayal, heartbreak, sorrow, is forgiveness....  not even necessarily forgiving the other (although that'd likely be beneficial) but forgiving oneself, giving the self permission to grieve and let the anger/hurt go ('coz really, hanging onto it is not good for self...) and to forgive and move on...

 

i think when 3S comes up for me as i read, I note that it's 'only' a #3, so there's 7 steps more to go in the suit of swords plus the court, so the journey through swords is reallly early stages, so carrying that broken heart through another 7+4 steps is gonna make those steps/stages reallllly hard...

 

so I like Elliott's perky approach (I think the book is "How to Give a Positive Reading in Any Situation") helps me a lot with 3S when it appears and I/querent gets that swift intake of breath after seeing th'image.

 

here's Hanson Roberts

 

Walter

[katrinka]

3 hours ago, WaltQuan said:

(I think the book is "How to Give a Positive Reading in Any Situation")

 

Why would anyone want to sugarcoat? Sometimes a timely warning is exactly what's needed.

[Rose Lalonde]

I associate personal heartbreak with the 5 of Cups. Mars (Tower) in Scorpio (Death) - a shattering and end in Cups. Fiery Mars drying up the water.  (In the aftermath, if I can harness that big Mars energy that walloped me, I might find the will to get up and start over elsewhere.)

 

The 3 of Swords I associate with 'world sorrow' the knowledge that all of us are subject to old age, sickness, and death. That nothing lasts forever, from favorite TV shows on up to the big stuff. Not to be a downer. Just, factually we're subject to those things, so it's reflected in tarot.  Weighty Saturn (Universe/World) and time in Libra (Adjustment/Justice). 

 

When I'm sad, drawing the 3S reminds me that I'm not being singled out, but that this is the nature of the world. It helps me open up.  I once drew the 9 of Cups when I was sad, and it made me feel worse in that moment, because even though things were going to get much better, it felt far away. 

Edited November 1, 2021 by Rose Lalonde

[Wyrdkiss]

2 hours ago, Rose Lalonde said:

 

When I'm sad, drawing the 3S reminds me that I'm not being singled out, but that this is the nature of the world. It helps me open up.  I once drew the 9 of Cups when I was sad, and it made me feel worse in that moment, because even though things were going to get much better, it felt far away. 

 

Yes, well stated Rose. Crowley regarding the Thoth describes the three of Swords as, "Weltschmerz, the Universal Sorrow. " Thoth scholar L.M.  DuQuette said, "the Three of Swords represents the wonderous trance of Sorrow that first enlightened the Buddha.  We should all be so lucky as to draw Sorrow from the deck."

 

In short, I tell my querents when facing this card that the path through the pain, not around it, will be the one with a hidden reward.  It's not a pleasant ride, but not every situation offers us the chance of significant emotional development and astute realization.

 

 

[Mi-Shell]

In readings I have quite often seen the 3S as

- 3 completely different aspects in a situation

- 3 differing opinions/ standpoints in a controversy having to now come together and work together

- 3 different ways of how a situation may turn out

- or even 3 different world views that exist in a family or a work environment

[Vesta]

On 9/29/2021 at 11:31 AM, RosieBlack said:

Do you think it relates more to the mental aspects of heartbreak, like when your mind is racing and you can't stop thinking about someone/something? Or do you think that regardless of the suit, it can still relate to heartbreak on an emotional level?

I would say all of the above.  Three swords through the heart equals intense pain whether mental or physical and as @malvina points out, the surrounding cards should tell more about the cause of the pain.  Recently I read (can't remember where) that when the card is reversed, the swords fall out and the pain begins to ease up.  

[WaltQuan]

On 11/1/2021 at 2:36 PM, katrinka said:

 

Why would anyone want to sugarcoat? Sometimes a timely warning is exactly what's needed.

I have the book with me now - 

 

Theresa Reed's introduction includes "... doesn't mean everything is sugarcoated - he never does that.  Instead, he's centred on being proactive, no matter what cards show up in a reading.  Rather than viewing the tarot through the lens of fear, there is hope and a way forward.... "

 

His own introduction alludes to Tarot's bad reputation and that he sees readings as an opportunity for healing.  (and for providing clients with ways to heal).

 

and I blew it, the book is actually called "Fearless Tarot: How to give a positive reading in any situation"

 

Even a timely warning can be offered in a spirit of helping, no?

 

 

[Wyrdkiss]

18 hours ago, TheThumbPuppy said:

 

That made me think of another possibility that I'd heard.

 

A triangulation, in the context of a narcissistic relationship:

 

 

Yes, and triangulation of other sorts -- as in psychological family dynamics, as well as love triangles and the mental toll of infidelity. It's a heavy card, for sure.

[katrinka]

Well, yes, a timely warning is a good thing.
I'm not too crazy about the implication that people are "viewing the Tarot through a lens of fear", though. Or that the Tarot has such a "bad reputation", or that it's a fortuneteller's responsibility to "heal" clients. It all comes off as manipulative.

[Grizabella]

Besides that, in order to "heal" people, that puts the reader into the position of a supposed counselor and no reader who isn't a formally trained and licensed counselor is qualified to do that nor should they try to be or profess to be.  The reader is there to give the message the cards contain. Period. Not to sugar coat or anything else. It's not the reader's opinion that matters. That has no place in a reading.  It's the cards and the "powers that be" who give the message.  The reader is just the mouthpiece for what the cards and the Higher Power are saying and the reader's translation of the cards is their job, nothing more. The reader isn't some witty, wise and wonderful person a cut above others who can advise their sitters on stuff----they're a servant of the cards, you might say.  A translator. 

[malvina]

5 minutes ago, Grizabella said:

Besides that, in order to "heal" people, that puts the reader into the position of a supposed counselor and no reader who isn't a formally trained and licensed counselor is qualified to do that nor should they try to be or profess to be.  The reader is there to give the message the cards contain. Period. Not to sugar coat or anything else. It's not the reader's opinion that matters. That has no place in a reading.  It's the cards and the "powers that be" who give the message.  The reader is just the mouthpiece for what the cards and the Higher Power are saying and the reader's translation of the cards is their job, nothing more. The reader isn't some witty, wise and wonderful person a cut above others who can advise their sitters on stuff----they're a servant of the cards, you might say.  A translator. 

This x100. All such authors who’re seemingly concerned about ~positivity and ethics~ only want to stroke their egos. They pretend that they possess some divine skill and thus have to be careful with how they bless other people  with it, so they install different hoops their students and clients have to jump through to be worthy of facing that power.

[katrinka]

Yes. A reader needs to stay as neutral as possible. We are, as Griz said, translators. We just relay the messages.
We wouldn't presume that our clients need "fixing", and even if they did, that's not our function. To assume otherwise is ego and arrogance.

[Eric13]

Ah, Grizabella said it perfectly!

[and_it_spoke]

Three of Swords always seemed like a natural for heartbreak to me - because you know it when it happens. It's a disappointment and you know something has not gone how you wished or would have wished. A recognized, unarguable 'loss' in the context of the moment/question.

 

"How is my new business venture going to turn out?" - 3 of Swords might imply in a way you will consider it disappointing. Not a disaster, maybe, and not forever - but there will be things you will see as a loss. Be prepared for that.

 

"Is my beau looking elsewhere for that sweet, sweet lovin'?" - 3 of Swords indicates yes. Which is a heartbreaking thought. But not that beau-beau has found that lovin', or will ditch the questioner.

 

T/he card is a necessary signifier that things may not go exactly as planned/hoped.

 

 

[WaltQuan]

9 hours ago, TheThumbPuppy said:

 

Theresa is offering here a typical example of people who in the same breath say something and the its opposite because they're afraid of alienating either side of their audience, although one can descend in the abyss of dialectic and argue that it wasn't exactly the same. But that is the arena of sophists and politicians. What I read at first sight was "doesn't mean everything is sugarcoated, but it could be covered with something sweet". That doesn't mean that we have to be cold interpreters of the cards meaning.

 

....

 

On a different line of analysis, the title of Theresa's book contains the word "fear", which is another manipulation of the psychological and physical reaction that is stimulated whenever we see or hear that word – it doesn't matter if it's suffixed by "less". It's a similar process if I was to intimate you, "Don't think of a pink elephant". If Theresa hadn't wanted to summon the power of the word "fear", she could have called her book "Courageous Tarot", "Confident Tarot", or something on that line. But that wouldn't have resulted in the same sales numbers, because "courageous", or "confident" do not raise as strong an emotional and hormonal response as "fear".

 

Well, on re-reading my post, it did sound a bit of a rant, for which I apologise for, but I'll press the submit button anyway. 🧐

 

 

 

 

whee...

 

CLARIFICATION:  Theresa Reed provided an introduction for Elliott Adam's book, FEARLESS TAROT: How to Give a Positive Reading in any Situation...

 

and you know, I don't think either of them (and I) would disagree with you...

 

I'd only cherry-picked (badly apparently) bits of Reed's endorsement and tried to give a bit of Adam's rationale for th'book - my impression (mine only, maybe completely wrong) is that Adam feels that Tarot cards have a bad reputation for creating fear (only) and he wants to give people-who-learn-tarot-by-reading-books some tools to assist their clients to move forward on their paths.

 

Fear can be a great motivator (as in your examples I just excised in the quote) but reading 'fear' for folks just for the sake of not giving them warm fuzzies is not what it's about for me.   I think there's a fine line between giving folks fear with motivation to move from that AND just givin' them 'whatever the hell I see in the cards, fear and feelings be damned'....   I still want to offer my clients the fear plus some possible paths of re/solution...  If I really wanted to just scare people, I'd work in politics,...  [g]

 

[newbie here - are we straying too far off topic of 3S, or is this okay?]

 

 

 

 

[katrinka]

2 minutes ago, WaltQuan said:

Fear can be a great motivator (as in your examples I just excised in the quote) but reading 'fear' for folks just for the sake of not giving them warm fuzzies

 

Nobody's reading "fear", we're reading events and possible events, what others may be planning, etc. The client's reaction is their own. We don't control that, nor should we presume we do. We don't even know how they're going to react. I've delivered bad news and the client was relieved, since they already suspected it. A lot of people are tired of fake readers filling them full of false hopes.

 

And it's not "just for the sake of not giving them warm fuzzies." It's what's on the table and we've been hired to tell them what the cards say. If we're paid to read cards, we need to read cards. Anything less is lying.
 

2 minutes ago, WaltQuan said:

is not what it's about for me.   I think there's a fine line between giving folks fear with motivation to move from that AND just givin' them 'whatever the hell I see in the cards, fear and feelings be damned'....   I still want to offer my clients the fear plus some possible paths of re/solution...

 

That would be another reading: "Can I avoid this?" "What can I do to prevent this?" etc.
Don't twist the initial reading into something it's not.
 

2 minutes ago, WaltQuan said:

  If I really wanted to just scare people, I'd work in politics,...  [g]

 

That assumes that we "just want to scare people." Not cool.