Conver Deck with Inscriptions

[fire cat pickles]

This N. Conver deck was published by Camoin between 1890 and 1900. It is from the Paul Marteau collection.

 

What is of interest to me are the inscriptions on the Majors cards. What are your thoughts about these?

 

For instance, on frame 147, the Moon card, you can see the words "ombre, or, reflet," or "shadow, gold, reflection."

 

https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b10539497f/f147.item.r=camoin tarot

 

Others are simpler (and more positive than I'm used to) such as a meaning for the Tower (f143): "balance" (équilibre)

 

https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b10539497f/f143.item.r=camoin tarot

 

How about these meanings for the Emperor and Pope "Temporary Power" and "Permanent? Power"

 

https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b10539497f/f119.item.r=camoin tarot

https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b10539497f/f121.item.r=camoin tarot

 

I've read before about the Hermit being assigned the "missing" virtue "Prudence." Well, here it is, folks:

 

https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b10539497f/f129.item.r=camoin tarot

 

The Wheel seems to have almost the opposite meaning here that most of us give to it: "Order." Today, we often give Wheel a meaning closer to "happenstance" or "chance" don't we?

 

https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b10539497f/f131.item.r=camoin tarot

 

Some of these are quite obvious, some not quite so. I will be working my way though the rest as time goes on, hopefully with help from others. I can't make out some of the inscriptions. Help requested

 

And if the frame doesn't load, just click the arrow forwards and/or backwards and it should load eventually. Though it is imperative that you click the Accept Cookies notification.

 

Thank you for participating!

 

FCP

 

 

 

[Raggydoll]

I find these cards incredibly fascinating and I love the simplicity of the keywords! I don’t speak French but I know we have other members who do and I think that together we can decipher the words, for sure.
 

Great initiative! 

[RunningWild]

12 hours ago, fire cat pickles said:

I can't make out some of the inscriptions. Help requested

If you're referring to the inscriptions on the upper left, they've transliterated the Hebrew letter.

 

....and then she looked to see who posted the OP who probably already knows all that stuff.

 

😳

[gregory]

That tower has a second word - guaïn, which rather startled me, but:

 

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/gaine

 

Your likeliest meaning here would be sheath. I cannot see vagina as fitting

Which others do you need ? The ones on the left seem to be more "background" - I see star, for instance, has meadow on the left, and immortality on the right.. On that basis sheath would kind of work for tower - either the shape or the protection offered.

But others are transliterations, as @RunningWild says.

Edited June 12, 2022 by gregory

[fire cat pickles]

17 minutes ago, gregory said:

That tower has a second word - guaïn, which rather startled me, but:

 

That one stumped me too, but then realized it was the Hebrew spelling for the letter Owain scribbled out incorrectly. (Each of the card have the Hebrew letter, some spelled out.)

[fire cat pickles]

4 hours ago, RunningWild said:

If you're referring to the inscriptions on the upper left, they've transliterated the Hebrew letter.

 

....and then she looked to see who posted the OP who probably already knows all that stuff.

 

😳

Thanks, I was mostly referring to the French on the right side.

[fire cat pickles]

28 minutes ago, gregory said:

But others are transliterations, as @RunningWild says.

 

If you scroll through some of the frames the French is a bit complicated. Some is hard to read and some very easy. I'm hoping for some help with the more complicated French. I'm working today so I won't be much good but when I get back home I'll  be posting more pictures of what I mean, Here is an example:

 

[Raggydoll]

I might be wrong but doesn’t it say Double Voie? (Two paths/tracks?). The word underneath might be Liberte (freedom). I can’t properly make out the first letter. Freedom to choose between two options? 

[RunningWild]

1 hour ago, gregory said:

That tower has a second word - guaïn, which rather startled me, but:

 

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/gaine

 

Your likeliest meaning here would be sheath. I cannot see vagina as fitting

Which others do you need ? The ones on the left seem to be more "background" - I see star, for instance, has meadow on the left, and immortality on the right.. On that basis sheath would kind of work for tower - either the shape or the protection offered.

But others are transliterations, as @RunningWild says.

It's the letter 'Ayin'.  The person making the notes probably couldn't quite make out what was being said if they were asking someone what the letter sounded like.

[gregory]

Oh. Oh well !

 

1 hour ago, Raggydoll said:

I might be wrong but doesn’t it say Double Voie? (Two paths/tracks?). The word underneath might be Liberte (freedom). I can’t properly make out the first letter. Freedom to choose between two options? 

 

I'd say so.

[Flaxen]

1 hour ago, Raggydoll said:

I might be wrong but doesn’t it say Double Voie? (Two paths/tracks?). The word underneath might be Liberte (freedom). I can’t properly make out the first letter. Freedom to choose between two options? 

That what it looks like to me too. 

[Morsoth]

On 6/11/2022 at 1:02 PM, fire cat pickles said:

How about these meanings for the Emperor and Pope "Temporary Power" and "Permanent? Power"

 

https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b10539497f/f119.item.r=camoin tarot

https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b10539497f/f121.item.r=camoin tarot

 

I'm French (from Quebec, Canada) and the handwritten notes are "Puissance Temporelle" (Temporal Power; related to time) for the Emperor, and "Puissance Spirituelle" (Spiritual Power) for the Pope.

[fire cat pickles]

Just now, Morsoth said:

 

I'm French (from Quebec, Canada) and the handwritten notes are "Puissance Temporelle" (Temporal Power; related to time) for the Emperor, and "Puissance Spirituelle" (Spiritual Power) for the Pope.

Ah! Thank you 🙂

[Morsoth]

1 minute ago, fire cat pickles said:

Ah! Thank you 🙂

No problem! Let me know if you need anything translated, that would be my pleasure to help!

[fire cat pickles]

 

Here is another one. The first word is "sagesse" or wisdom. The second word I believe is "science", which has a different connotation than the English word "Science." It is more philosophical in nature. But It appears to have more letters in it. Is there another French word there? I can't quite make it out...

[gregory]

On 6/11/2022 at 6:02 PM, fire cat pickles said:

This N. Conver deck was published by Camoin between 1890 and 1900. It is from the Paul Marteau collection.

 

What is of interest to me are the inscriptions on the Majors cards. What are your thoughts about these?

 

For instance, on frame 147, the Moon card, you can see the words "ombre, or, reflet," or "shadow, gold, reflection."

 

https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b10539497f/f147.item.r=camoin tarot

 

 I make it ombre ET reflet. Look at the lower case t on reflet.

[_R_]

On 6/11/2022 at 6:02 PM, fire cat pickles said:

How about these meanings for the Emperor and Pope "Temporary Power" and "Permanent? Power"

 

= Temporal and spiritual power.

On 6/12/2022 at 11:28 AM, fire cat pickles said:

Here is an example:

 

= Double voie - the two paths.

 

On 6/14/2022 at 3:53 PM, fire cat pickles said:

Here is another one. The first word is "sagesse" or wisdom. The second word I believe is "science", which has a different connotation than the English word "Science." It is more philosophical in nature. But It appears to have more letters in it. Is there another French word there? I can't quite make it out...

= Learning, or knowledge. It looks like a scratch rather than extra letters.

 

Also, what Gregory said about shadows /and/ reflections.

 

[Raggydoll]

Let’s do some of the others 😀

Le Monde has a lot of writing on it

 

Let’s see:.. Synthesis, egg of Brahma, key?

and is it a misspelled quantum ? It also has an equal armed cross, and a cross + upward pointing triangle. Synthesis of spirit and matter? 

 

 

as for the bateleur.. Tetragrammaton principe  ? Is that why his face is so puzzled ? 😊

 

Does it say Etre universal? As in Being Universal? Or universal being? 🤔 (Like I said, I don’t speak French 😄)

Pan. 
 

 

There are more we haven’t mentioned. Plus I believe a few of the minors have writing as well. 

[Raggydoll]

Another three.
Intelligence, victory, and .. property? 
 

 

 

[gregory]

2 hours ago, Raggydoll said:

Another three.
Intelligence, victory, and .. property? 
 

 

 

Ownership, property - can also include property in the sense of quality - "vinegar has disinfectant properties" - OR appropriateness, suitability - which I would have thought more suitable here. Proper-ness....

Edited June 19, 2022 by gregory

[Raggydoll]

7 minutes ago, gregory said:

 

Ownership, property - OR appropriateness, suitability - which I would have thought more suitable here. Proper-ness....

I think it is interesting to compare these keywords to those of Papus. For justice he has ‘repartition’.

[gregory]

And universal (of the world ?) equilibrium. Repartition can mean redistribution - spreading property around more fairly ? Balancing society ?

Edited June 19, 2022 by gregory

[Raggydoll]

34 minutes ago, gregory said:

And universal (of the world ?) equilibrium. Repartition can mean redistribution - spreading property around more fairly ? Balancing society ?

Yes that was my thought. I felt those two meanings (Papus plus the keywords for this deck) were going in similar directions 

[_R_]

14 hours ago, Raggydoll said:

Le Monde has a lot of writing on it

 

 

Synthesis, Egg of Brahma, Quatuor, F clef, alchemical sulphur.

 

14 hours ago, Raggydoll said:

Does it say Etre universal? As in Being Universal? Or universal being? 🤔 (Like I said, I don’t speak French 😄)

Pan. 
 

= Universal Being

 

[gregory]

Great to see you, @_R_.

 

What about that Justice thing ? Am I on to anything at all here ? (I have some French, but I suspect not good enough...)

 

13 hours ago, gregory said:

Ownership, property - can also include property in the sense of quality - "vinegar has disinfectant properties" - OR appropriateness, suitability - which I would have thought more suitable here. Proper-ness....