Your reading state and clarity with indulgence.

[Wyrdkiss]

Discussion: who reads fully clear and sober? Who prefers a bit of alcohol or other indulgence? Old pic here with a shot of spiced rum for the spirits. I no longer drink or even smoke nicotine, and my sessions are more satisfying than ever before.  Everyone is different,  however, so share what works for you. Please don't mention things that are illegal let's keep this thread unlocked.

[Misterei]

I'm pretty strict about no alcohol as i feel it doesn't support the reading process.

 

I'm not as strict about cannabis [legal where i live]. I tend to go into a meditative state with cannabis so it doesn't interfere.

At times I had to read whilst on opiate pain meds [perscribed by doctor] due to extreme pain. Again, I can access meditative states on this type of med as long as it's a light dose. PAIN interferes with getting into a meditation so this was definitely the lesser evil!

Conversely, there have been other perscriptions that interfered with accessing a meditative state ... so i don't take those no matter what doctors say.

 

My preference is for reading 100% sober. I do my best work this way.

 

I recently left a spiritual group where certain people repeated like parrots that alcohol, cannabis, or opiates "blow holes in your aura".

i always thought this was stupid, lazy thinking by people who've never actually experienced life.

Yes, alcohol harms the aura of alcoholics ... but the ancient Greeks used wine and mushrooms as a spiritual sacrament. So ... wtf??

As someone who's taken loads of cannabis and opiate pain meds through life ... NONE of these things "blew a hole in my aura". What does that even mean for f*ck's sake???

OK ... sorry for the tangent. Still a bit angry apparently 🙄

Meanwhile even alcohol is good for certain things spiritually. It helps if you've had an emotional shock. I had to get a bit drunk when i was throwing precious dance costumes i sewed onto the fire in a sort of death cleaning viking funeral for my old life sacrifices to the Gods of Dance ritual burn. I don't think I could have done it without the drink ... and it was spiritually profound.

Edited April 6, 2024 by Misterei

[dancing_moon]

I used to light some incense during a reading, but found that it distracted me more than it helped. Clear mind = clear readings. I might indulge myself with a cup of tea, though😆

[Misterei]

3 minutes ago, dancing_moon said:

... I might indulge myself with a cup of tea, though😆

Herbal tea is de rigeur!

[dancing_moon]

8 minutes ago, Misterei said:

Herbal tea is de rigeur!

 

I love herbal teas, but I do need my caffeine - does that count as "indulgence"? 🤔

[Misterei]

5 minutes ago, dancing_moon said:

I love herbal teas, but I do need my caffeine - does that count as "indulgence"? 🤔

The mormons would say "yes".

I must be careful with caffeine. Too much would actually interfere with meditative state as it makes me jittery and not quite present in the present moment. But I'm not above a small afternoon tea if I must read and I feel dull and lifeless.

Edited April 6, 2024 by Misterei

[dancing_moon]

2 minutes ago, Misterei said:

But I'm not above a small afternoon tea if I must read and I feel dull and lifeless.

 

It's very good for that. And for the other times of the day, decaffeinated tea works well for me. (A tea addict here 😆) 

[Wyrdkiss]

Thanks for the responses. I should drink more tea, on the decaf side especially.  I can find incense distracting too, even sage or palo santo.  

On that note, I do not even read if significantly caffeinated. I must pace myself on that too as it really can impact negatively my focus.

 

 

[DanielJUK]

I've read about some people / cultures who go under the influence for their divination / connection / trance / meditative journey. It's a deliberate act to take things that alter the mind to connect to the subconscious

 

 

I'm getting so boring getting into middle age, but I need to have things in moderation to do readings! Like one glass of wine is okay but if I have more than that, I cannot concentrate on the reading. Same if I feel very tired or emotional. I need a quiet place really and to be able to concentrate and not too distracted by anything. I find I have to do it in silence really and it does take concentration to work on a reading. I couldn't do a good job if I am too impaired.

 

[Misterei]

3 hours ago, DanielJUK said:

I've read about some people / cultures who go under the influence for their divination / connection / trance / meditative journey. It's a deliberate act to take things that alter the mind to connect to the subconscious ...

I think this is why I find myself so angry when people have the bad bad shame shame attitude toward psychoactives. Humans have done this spiritual practice for millennia. No one wants to get read by a stoner or drunk ... but if the reader is using a substance in a shamanistic sense and it aids the psychic process ... why not?

[Aeon418]

13 hours ago, Misterei said:

No one wants to get read by a stoner or drunk ... but if the reader is using a substance in a shamanistic sense and it aids the psychic process ... why not?

 

This is a difficult one. In theory there can be no objection to the use of so-called "sacred substances." Shamanism is as old as the hills. But at the present time the very notion of sacred seems to have disappeared with the rise of recreational usage, where increasing numbers of people "use" to merely feel normal. This necessarily places an extra responsibility on readers/diviners who don't want to cheapen their art by turning it into yet another excuse to get high.   

[akiva]

When I used to partake in the devils lettuce there was a sweet spot to it. Just a little bit seemed to greatly enhance perception. Details in readings that wouldn't normally be noticed came through, along with stronger visual impressions. It also enhanced the ability to put those impressions into words too.

I'd never stay at that sweet spot though, as I was a recreational user, which ended up making tarot readings difficult. It would also make reiki flow weird, my hands would go cold after smoking it (it lowers blood pressure) and so would the reiki, which wasn't very enjoyable. And sometimes it just wouldn't flow at all.

 

I decided to quit after doing it for a looong time, and now only practice divination/reiki sober. There's a few things I'd like to try doing readings with, like blue lotus and other gentler herbs that are supposed to enhance things, but I'm in no rush! Reading clear and sober is quite fun 😁 

 

On 4/6/2024 at 4:51 PM, Wyrdkiss said:

I no longer drink or even smoke nicotine, and my sessions are more satisfying than ever before.

What difference do you find in your readings after quitting drink and nicotine that makes them more satisfying? 😊

[Tanga]

Interesting.

I read sober. I'm not a drinker. A mild cup of caffeinated tea is OK. Herbal tea is yummy & preferable...

Favourite oils in the burner, or my favourite incense put me in a more centred/receptive mood.  I've had the experience in the past - as an Aromatherapist - that if I work inhaling oils all-day-long - I feel like I'm drunk by the end of the day. So - I am sensitive to scent. I quit Aromatherapy due to being "drunk", as well as beginning to develop allergies to the oils.

Strong Coffee... NO.

 

Whilst I was learning to read Tarot aeons ago (formal Tarot course at The College Of Psychic Studies, London, UK) - one night after a day of work, I was due at the college for a class. I had had a bad night and found myself unable to stay awake on reception duty so I had a very strong coffee.  Woke me up alright.  

That evening - I read, like I'd never read before - it was wonderful - I was wildly plugged into "the other" - messages all clear, confidence through the roof.   But on the way home on public transport, I felt like my aura had been stripped clean away (what strong caffeine does to me) and I could feel EVERYONE in the crowded carriage around me complete with all their "stuff".  It was horrible!

 

I agree with @Aeon418 - how does one know what type of "user" is presenting to you?  

When I attended The College Of Psychic Studies for training, they had a policy about users, probably for this very reason.  I've encountered some "interesting" ideas people have about "enlightenment fast and sexy please with a little smoke" - or whatever else - circumventing the whole idea of experiencing the journey - or even having any self-awareness at all to start off with.  And...one year at a Kung Fu club I long since abandoned - our teacher (who had just been on a retreat to South America) one night, decided to surprise us all with an evening tobacco ceremony instead of a Kung Fu class. Now a) we had not been informed - it was completely out-of-the-blue. So... the great majority of students had no idea why, or what the premise of a tobacco ceremony even was!  And b) they were ill-prepared to even lead it. Ofcourse - a number of students that partook of the tobacco threw up - their systems not used to the herb.  I left the club that night, after I waited around until the end, to make sure no one passed out and needed an ambulance ( I was already on my way out of the club, due to other unprofessional conduct from the tutor).

Edited April 8, 2024 by Tanga

[Misterei]

On 4/7/2024 at 10:35 AM, Aeon418 said:

This is a difficult one. In theory there can be no objection to the use of so-called "sacred substances." Shamanism is as old as the hills. But at the present time the very notion of sacred seems to have disappeared with the rise of recreational usage ...

This worked the opposite way for me [as many things do]. As a teenager I was all about the recreational. I tried Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds. Profound spiritual experience that changed my life. Same thing with "recreational" use of cannabis. I had some deeply spiritual/psychic experiences that changed me in fundamental ways.

 

I'm pretty sure this was past life stuff ... if i used mind-altering substances for spiritual practices in past incarnations ... the effects occurred in this life even when i was young, stupid, and partying. I was hardwired for spiritual or psychic experiences on drugs in a way that others were not.

 

Perhaps there's no "one size fits all". The knee jerk reaction that mind-altering substances are always "bad" and "they blow holes in your aura" is silly. Likewise the idea that you will enhance your reading practice if you habitually depend on a chemical crutch.

 

LOL Here I am in the Middle Way again ... my preference is for reading 100% sober [and that includes even strong doses of caffeine] ... but I read just fine with my mind altered on certain substances, too. As @akiva mentions there's a sweet spot where one is aided and not stupified.

 

I must admit tho ... a couple of ppl who are respected in Tarot / Spiritual community have mentioned using ritalin. A lot.  Reading for clients or doing YT readings on ritalin ... and I found myself judging them harshly for it.

Edited April 9, 2024 by Misterei

[akiva]

2 hours ago, Misterei said:

LOL Here I am in the Middle Way again ... my preference is for reading 100% sober [and that includes even strong doses of caffeine] ... but I read just fine with my mind altered on certain substances, too. As @akiva mentions there's a sweet spot where one is aided and not stupified.

 

I must admit tho ... a couple of ppl who are respected in Tarot / Spiritual community have mentioned using ritalin. A lot.  Reading for clients or doing YT readings on ritalin ... and I found myself judging them harshly for it.

I wonder if ritalin activates the sweet spot? In very small doses cannabis acts as a stimulant, while still being psychoactive. It's hard to describe, but it left room for the psychic faculties. I'm guessing ritalin is a whole other kettle of fish regarding stimulation... I know people use it as a study aide in college/uni, but I'm not sure how effective it would be for tarot reading. Other than the gift of the gab 😅 

 

All this reminds me of the 8 levels of consciousness and how each circuit/level can be activated through different activities (and drugs). It's worth a read 😁

[Aeon418]

12 hours ago, Misterei said:

I was hardwired for spiritual or psychic experiences on drugs in a way that others were not.

 

This is the idiosyncratic feature of drug usage. For a small minority that are "ripe" the experience may be the catalyst that initiates a fundamental baseline shift within the psyche. But for most people the effect is relatively shallow and temporary. They literally can't "get back there" without the drug and need to rely on it as a crutch, possibly to the point of permanent damage. After a brief day trip to the top of the mountain, they are right back at the bottom when the effect wears off.

 

For most people the way to attain and anchor these fundamental baseline shifts in consciousness is the old fashioned way through disciplined practice of traditional mystical / meditational / magical techniques. This work may or may not be facilitated by the use of substances for clearly defined ends, but the attempt to do this with drugs alone probably won't work for the vast majority of people in any lasting sense. (Although a kind disassociation is not uncommon among people who fail to integrate their drug experience in the grounding of practical work.)  

 

If there is a positive side, drug experiences may open the 'door' enough to convince someone that there actually is 'something' worth working for by more conventional means.    

Edited April 9, 2024 by Aeon418

[Wyrdkiss]

On 4/7/2024 at 1:55 PM, akiva said:

When I used to partake in the devils lettuce there was a sweet spot to it. Just a little bit seemed to greatly enhance perception. Details in readings that wouldn't normally be noticed came through, along with stronger visual impressions. It also enhanced the ability to put those impressions into words too.

I'd never stay at that sweet spot though, as I was a recreational user, which ended up making tarot readings difficult. It would also make reiki flow weird, my hands would go cold after smoking it (it lowers blood pressure) and so would the reiki, which wasn't very enjoyable. And sometimes it just wouldn't flow at all.

 

I decided to quit after doing it for a looong time, and now only practice divination/reiki sober. There's a few things I'd like to try doing readings with, like blue lotus and other gentler herbs that are supposed to enhance things, but I'm in no rush! Reading clear and sober is quite fun 😁 

 

What difference do you find in your readings after quitting drink and nicotine that makes them more satisfying? 😊

First portion of your response is so true for many facets of life, especially what is taken into the body.  A smidge of caffeine helps my focus, over doing it trashes it, for example, just as others said above. That includes at work as well, anywhere of importance.  Congrats on sobriety if the sweet Spot was being dismissed and exceeded for whatever reason.

 

To answer your question, I never read for others while using alcohol.  I think my overall state is better with those substances not in my system, but when I did have those private relaxation sessions, as enjoyable as they were from a "I deserve this" perspective, I simply did not get as much out of the readings as I currently do now.  I was more distracted on "the treat" rather than the process. That could be from a myriad of factors, including learned experience, but I'm certain I spend more time with the duration of the cards than those prior solo sessions, and more time journaling as well.

 

Edited April 9, 2024 by Wyrdkiss

[Misterei]

3 hours ago, Aeon418 said:

This is the idiosyncratic feature of drug usage. For a small minority that are "ripe" the experience may be the catalyst that initiates a fundamental baseline shift within the psyche. But for most people the effect is relatively shallow and temporary. ...

... For most people the way to attain and anchor these fundamental baseline shifts in consciousness is the old fashioned way through disciplined practice of traditional mystical / meditational / magical techniques. ...

True enough. Even as a kid I understood when something special had happened ... and spent my whole life pursuing it through all means including yoga, meditation, prayer. I don't want to say the "old fashioned way" b/c psychoactives ARE the old fashioned way ... but moderns have profaned sacred substances the same way we profaned tarot itself.

[prolly a controversial statement but i think mass produced decks on Halloween display at Walmart is profaning tarot].

 

In any case, human beings want a short cut. People want to learn tarot without memorizing cards. People want to become gurus or shamans by taking some mushroom without learning to meditate. Both are commodified in a consumer society. You can be a "witch" by buying some tarot cards and a black outfit. You can be a shaman by ingesting substances at a shaman training retreat.  *sigh*

[akiva]

19 hours ago, Wyrdkiss said:

To answer your question, I never read for others while using alcohol.  I think my overall state is better with those substances not in my system, but when I did have those private relaxation sessions, as enjoyable as they were from a "I deserve this" perspective, I simply did not get as much out of the readings as I currently do now.  I was more distracted on "the treat" rather than the process. That could be from a myriad of factors, including learned experience, but I'm certain I spend more time with the duration of the cards than those prior solo sessions, and more time journaling as well.

I found it to be the same regarding the treat ending up distracting. So congratulations on your sobriety too 😆

[potsticker126]

Think for me it depends, for tarot sometimes a light drink does help with my mood and intuition in general (say a glass of wine or a cocktail). Yet for other divination methods that I use (i-ching related for example, Dayan or the 4 pillars of destiny), will need to use them when I'm 120% sober and level-headed because I really need to use the logic side of my mind to crack open the meanings. They of course all work very well and are tremendously enlightening in their own regard, yet just on very generalized off-hand impressions, tarot for me is more like 80% intuition and 20% knowledge/logic, while i-ching is 80% knowledge/logic and 20% intuition. So in the end it all boils down to the differences in different methods I guess? 

[Twinkle]

I haven't tried reading with any 'sacred substances'. I would like to have a little incense, bowl-singing to tune me to the state of reading, though I agree heavily incensed environment can be distracting. 

I won't say there's absolutely no benefits of these substances, but their influences are hard to control. To maintain my reading's overall quality, I will practice with merely my deck. I know many readers work in chaotic markets and bars. It's important to be able to stay connected in most flexible environment. For me, keeping a balanced state of mind & body is the only preparation I will need for reading. 

[Moonhart44]

I have had a journey working on my sobriety. I learn that it is me escaping myself. Honestly I think I am too much but thats where the journey of self love comes in

I believe you should be sober because it will affect any kind of magical practice youre doing. Unless your goal is to be more vulnerable to spiritual interferences. I have a feeling reading while inebriated is bad mostly if you are not spiritually protected or have a strong mentality. When I did do it (and it was only maybe 3 times max, and it was from drinking) i started seeing shadow figures and one waved at me. Spiritually speaking, if i had not stopped and focused on mental strength and setting actual spiritual boundaries, i would have been vulnerable to something out of my control

[Guest]

I'm a bit of a square lol. I've never in my life been drunk though I do drink socially - hazards of the trade. Never smoked, never did drugs, never doped - nada. Only time I've ever read without my full mental faculties is when I'm sleepy or hungry. Or when I'm very anxious, in which case maybe I should not have proceeded with it. 

[Morwenna]

I always read sober. My low confidence has always indicated to me that I need all the clarity I can get. In fact, when I was reading at renfaires years ago, I would insist on sobriety the night before as well, and on a good night's sleep, and on a very nutritious (but not heavy) breakfast on the morning of. If it was a 2-day event and the group I was with went out to eat together on the first evening, if I dared have any alcohol at dinner it was only one followed by plenty of food, with time enough before bed to let it wear off. But ordinarily, not even that. And no caffeine at breakfast either.

 

At home, I don't think I've ever read after any alcohol. And as much as I love incense, I don't remember ever burning any while reading. I never thought of incense smoke being a distraction, but I can see where that might happen. The sense of smell is the most directly connected to the brain of all the senses.