Do you read with reversals? - Poll

[DanielJUK]

Thought it would be interesting to see how many members do read with reversals and how many don't 🙂 

 

Comments welcome on this below and why / how you voted

[fire cat pickles]

I answered "infrequently, " because every now and then one will appear inexplicably in a reading.  It is very rare, but it happens.  I do use dignities,  which are not technically reversals. 

[RunningWild]

Ditto here on if it somehow comes up that way then I’ll go with it.  I don’t use dignities unless it’s a large spread and absent something that might balance things better.  Then I’ll take a look.

[dancing_moon]

I don't normally use reversals, but have been experimenting with using them for the RWS deck.

[Natural Mystic Guide]

'Half of the time I use them, half the time not' seemed the most appropriate choice for me regarding how often I may use reversals.  To elaborate:  There are some decks where it may not be appropriate to use reversals because of the nature of the deck.  Then, with a circular deck, depending on where the card lines up in relationship to truly reversed or truly upright, I get a more 'nuanced' reversal meaning.

 

I work with elementals a lot, so each card -- even each Major Arcana card, is associated with a certain element.  I assign an element to each position in a spread (earth, water, air, and fire).  Earth and Water cards are harmonious or well aspected when they fall in a earth or water position.  They are poorly aspected or 'ill dignified' if they fall in a air or fire position.  Air and Fire cards are harmonious or well aspected when they fall in an air or fire position.  They are poorly aspected or 'ill dignified' if the fall in an earth or water position.  So being poor aspected or ill dignified is like being reversed.

 

When I do an 'Evaluating Options' reading it is the ratio of upright to reversed cards along with the strength of the cards (Minor versus Major Arcana) that determines the value of each option.

 

My Tarot Netivot system is very simple in that upright cards always carry a positive message -- for any card and any suit.  Reversed cards always carry a 'negative' message -- meaning that they represent the shadow side of a card, or a challenge, or a lesson, or a red flag.

 

So using reversals can greatly expand a repertoire of card meanings.

 

[Shaira]

I used to use reversals when I first started out (with a RWS-style deck, the Sacred Rose) many moons ago, because that's how I thought you did things. But more and more I got hung up on the whole "how do you shuffle for reversals?" question, so these days I don't use physical reversals at all. Instead, I use elemental dignities, and I treat the most negative of the possible dignity influences as a "virtual reversal". So, if the Three of Swords is flanked by the Five of Pentacles and the Nine of Pentacles, say, in a spread, then I treat the Three of Swords as effectively reversed. Often in a spread I'll quickly scan the cards before starting to read, and identify any such reversals and physically turn the card round so I don't forget. The other elemental dignity effects I don't usually physically mark, although I suppose I could really turn the cards through 90 degrees clockwise or counterclockwise if I needed to. Usually there aren't that many dignity mods in a spread, however. 

[Raggydoll]

I use them sometimes but mostly not! 

[Chariot]

I always use reversals in tarot readings—although never in oracle readings.

I don't see a reversal as 'negative' but rather as 'opposite.'  Since no two upright cards deal with exactly the same thing, this allowing of reversals doubles the tarot's vocabulary AND eliminates guessing whether the card's upright side or 'shadow side' is in play just then.  I don't do readings in order to increase my need to guess; I do readings to get insight into what is actually happening or is being considered.

As far as how I shuffle for reversals, I simply turn all cards face down at the start on a clean surface and deliberately swirl them around for a while.  Then I pick them up and shuffle thoroughly in other ways (riffle, hand to hand, depending on the card stock) but keeping the up/down orientation intact.

Edited August 9, 2024 by Chariot

[Ix Chel]

I never use reversals. It is hard enough to know the upright card meanings.

[Kluizenaar]

No, reversals are too confusing to me. Do they mean the opposite? Do they mean the extreme? Do they mean only the downsides, not the upsides? It all depends on the card, on the reader, on the other cards in the spread. 

 

Upright cards are meaningful enough, so no need for reversals. 

[Wyrdkiss]

Started w/ Thoth so I never used reversals, and still do not now that I've branched out to many different packs.

I find proper and varied spreads more than offer enough opportunity to look at a card meaning from all angles.

[gregory]

Infrequently - as I do use them when required to in an exercise, or if specifically asked to, but never from choice.

Edited August 9, 2024 by gregory

[Chariot]

16 hours ago, Kluizenaar said:

No, reversals are too confusing to me. Do they mean the opposite? Do they mean the extreme? Do they mean only the downsides, not the upsides? It all depends on the card, on the reader, on the other cards in the spread. 

 

Upright cards are meaningful enough, so no need for reversals. 

I used to suffer from those same dilemmas.  However, I eventually decided that, for me, a reversal would mean the opposite (or lack) of the upright card's meaning.  Trying to determine whether a reversal intensified or diminished the upright card's meaning simply didn't work for me.  I prefer a clearer starting point.  So I made the decision myself. 🙂

Edited August 10, 2024 by Chariot

[FindYourSovereignty]

7 hours ago, Chariot said:

I used to suffer from those same dilemmas.  However, I eventually decided that, for me, a reversal would mean the opposite (or lack) of the upright card's meaning.  Trying to determine whether a reversal intensified or diminished the upright card's meaning simply didn't work for me.  I prefer a clearer starting point.  So I made the decision myself. 🙂

 

My experience as well. I believe it is being consistent about what you want reversals to mean/say/represent to you as the reader. This is the bond created between you and the cards. Just like deciding upright cards communicate to us in a specific way, so do the reverse. The bond, imo, is created through consistency. I have heard (maybe someone in this forum shared) there are tarot teachers that require five years of reading upright before they introduce reading reversals. I can see value in this as the connection created with the cards and the comfort level of reading tarot grows.

[Misterei]

On 8/8/2024 at 3:47 PM, DanielJUK said:

Thought it would be interesting to see how many members do read with reversals and how many don't 🙂 

 

Comments welcome on this below and why / how you voted

Interesting!

I just wrote in another thread I guessed 70% of readers used them. But that isn't true for this group.

i'm surprised but also see that I'm in good company 🙂

As mentioned in the other post, I use them for special reading and topics only [infrequent].

[RickInBakersfield]

I was a Psycard oracle reader and reversals were never used with that deck.

 

I did get Mary K. Greer's book on Tarot Reversals, but even to this day, I read Tarot cards upright.

 

Too much to learn, I guess.

[Vento]

Although im beginner reader and my skills are on very amateur level i would take a chance to express my point of view here.

I do not use reversed carts, whats more I honestly think that the one who invented them complicated this divination method. There are 78 cards in Tarot deck, this number is huge, especially if you compare them to other decks for e.g. Lenormand which consist of 36 cards. What's more each Tarot card have diffrent specific meaning, the variety of them give reader very large amount ways to interpreting future, in my point there are infinite.

What's more we don't know how exactly this carts were created and from where there are coming from. Some say that their roots are in occultism - i won't discuss that in this topic, but just think: if original author of this cards, or some entity which created them would feel that decks is not giving sufficent way to foresee future wouldn't he add some carts to deck?

Bear in mind that, like I said number of carts is gigantic and you can easily foresee with smaller one which Lenormand carts prove us. The next thing to all reversal readers: were you ever thinking that by using them you are leaving from original Tarot version and create new one - your deck don't consist of 78 carts, to be honest you have twice that number! This method just led to mess.

Im coming from Europe and I recently read Tarot web topics in my country. Can you imagine that readers in my country complicated this divination method even more, they starts to summarize cards numbers which they got during reading and later divide it by number of cards they used and the number they got is "Summary Card" -  for them determing whole reading! Thats ridicolous! I don't know if you have spotted that method, maybe even in this forum there are some readers who use it but come on..     (I dont read every topic).

I gave that example just to make you conscious what terrible experience reversing card method led to - because I personally thing that one deviation from original method leds to another one. Original content and meaning is lost. However to be honest I need to admit that i have spotted some exellent readers which were using reversals and they were able to foresee upcoming events in accurate way.  But just keep in mind that it's not about original Tarot, but your own version of it. Over - interpretation is a trap. Hope that experienced readers wont eat me for that 😊

[Endless]

I don't use reversals. The 78 cards of a tarot deck bear enough meanings and multiple perspectives to cover all eventualities and including them only seems to add confusion to a reading.

Like others here have mentioned, knowing the traditional meanings of each cards in their upright position is hard enough as it is, haha.



 

[Moon-Hermit]

I always use reversals in my readings, because: 1- I resonate most with the RWS tradition. I’ve studied Thoth and Marseille as well, but never really connected to them. 2- Without reversals, I feel like something is missing in my readings? It’s like I’m trying to neglect the shadow side of the cards that I fear. I know that some cards are neither positive nor negative in their essence, but seeing them from both angles just feels right to me. I always gain more insight that way. 😊

[Moon-Hermit]

2 hours ago, Endless said:

I don't use reversals. The 78 cards of a tarot deck bear enough meanings and multiple perspectives to cover all eventualities and including them only seems to add confusion to a reading.

Like others here have mentioned, knowing the traditional meanings of each cards in their upright position is hard enough as it is, haha.



 

I learned both meanings together for each single card back when I was still studying the very basics. I guess it’s different for everyone, but don’t scare yourself with the number of the cards; tarot is actually a lot easier for me to grasp than Lenormand or playing cards, mainly because it’s stronger in terms of visuals and stuff. Which tradition of tarot do you prefer, btw?

[Chariot]

On 8/11/2024 at 12:15 PM, Vento said:

Although im beginner reader and my skills are on very amateur level i would take a chance to express my point of view here.

I do not use reversed carts, whats more I honestly think that the one who invented them complicated this divination method. There are 78 cards in Tarot deck, this number is huge, especially if you compare them to other decks for e.g. Lenormand which consist of 36 cards. What's more each Tarot card have diffrent specific meaning, the variety of them give reader very large amount ways to interpreting future, in my point there are infinite.

What's more we don't know how exactly this carts were created and from where there are coming from. Some say that their roots are in occultism - i won't discuss that in this topic, but just think: if original author of this cards, or some entity which created them would feel that decks is not giving sufficent way to foresee future wouldn't he add some carts to deck?

Bear in mind that, like I said number of carts is gigantic and you can easily foresee with smaller one which Lenormand carts prove us. The next thing to all reversal readers: were you ever thinking that by using them you are leaving from original Tarot version and create new one - your deck don't consist of 78 carts, to be honest you have twice that number! This method just led to mess.

Im coming from Europe and I recently read Tarot web topics in my country. Can you imagine that readers in my country complicated this divination method even more, they starts to summarize cards numbers which they got during reading and later divide it by number of cards they used and the number they got is "Summary Card" -  for them determing whole reading! Thats ridicolous! I don't know if you have spotted that method, maybe even in this forum there are some readers who use it but come on..     (I dont read every topic).

I gave that example just to make you conscious what terrible experience reversing card method led to - because I personally thing that one deviation from original method leds to another one. Original content and meaning is lost. However to be honest I need to admit that i have spotted some exellent readers which were using reversals and they were able to foresee upcoming events in accurate way.  But just keep in mind that it's not about original Tarot, but your own version of it. Over - interpretation is a trap. Hope that experienced readers wont eat me for that 😊

No of course we won't eat you or give you a hard time!  Everybody develops their own method of reading cards, if they keep doing it.  Some things will change, some won't.  Lots of excellent readers don't use reversals.

I have always used reversals, but they CAN be confusing unless you get a grip on them and make it clear in your own mind how you will interpret them.  78 Cards may seem like a lot, and is certainly just about the greatest number of cards anybody can physically shuffle, deal, etc.  However, if you believe that each card is different from all other cards, then that still only gives you 78 'words.'  When you look at it that way, it can be quite limiting.  If you decide that a reversal means the opposite (or the absence) of the original meaning, then that gives you 156 'words,' without having to mess around with a huge deck of cards.   And no, you don't have to learn 156 meanings. All  you need to do is learn the 78—but just reverse the meaning if the card comes up reversed in a spread. 

For me, the confusion came from the notion that a reversal can mean a weakening of the original meaning, an intensifying of the original meaning, or the opposite, etc.  Once I decided to employ only the 'opposite' for interpretation, it all became pretty simple, really.  I like a straightforward approach to tarot.  It's up to me, in the context of the reading, to decide whether a card's influence is strong or weak, I reckon.  A lot of that has to do with the surrounding cards and the position in the spread.

For example, if the Hermit upright card is in a 'past' position, then obviously its influence is weakening.  You were off by yourself in the past, but that's not the case any more.  If it's in a future position, then it's strengthening—you WILL likely be going off by yourself.  In the present, you ARE hiding off by yourself just now, in some way.

The same principle applies if the Hermit is reversed—it's just that the meaning will be opposite.  A reversed Hermit in the past means you did not go off by yourself back then, for whatever the reason.  In the future, it means you won't be going off by yourself, but are likely to be engaging with others instead.  And in the present, a reversed Hermit might mean that you crave some time to yourself, but aren't getting it.   Whether that's a good thing or a bad thing will be clear when you consider the other surrounding cards. 

Edited September 21, 2024 by Chariot

[FindYourSovereignty]

53 minutes ago, Chariot said:

For me, the confusion came from the notion that a reversal can mean a weakening of the original meaning, an intensifying of the original meaning, or the opposite, etc.  Once I decided to employ only the 'opposite' for interpretation, it all became pretty simple, really.  I like a straightforward approach to tarot.  It's up to me, in the context of the reading, to decide whether a card's influence is strong or weak, I reckon.  A lot of that has to do with the surrounding cards and the position in the spread.

I think this is the very reason some professional teachers insist on upright readings for a lengthy period of time. How does one solidify their personal relationship with reversals until they are very solid with their personal relationship with the upright meaning? You chose opposite, but someone else may choose a weakening or intensifying or an alert, etc. And many others want to allow intuition to lead them on which way to read the reversal in each reading. 

 

On 8/11/2024 at 7:15 AM, Vento said:

I honestly think that the one who invented them complicated this divination method.

On 8/11/2024 at 7:15 AM, Vento said:

if original author of this cards, or some entity which created them would feel that decks is not giving sufficent way to foresee future wouldn't he add some carts to deck?

On 8/11/2024 at 7:15 AM, Vento said:

were you ever thinking that by using them you are leaving from original Tarot version and create new one - your deck don't consist of 78 carts, to be honest you have twice that number!

On 8/11/2024 at 7:15 AM, Vento said:

But just keep in mind that it's not about original Tarot, but your own version of it. Over - interpretation is a trap.

Some very interesting thoughts to ponder indeed. Thank you for sharing. 

[Ferrea]

On 8/11/2024 at 1:15 PM, Vento said:

[…]

Im coming from Europe and I recently read Tarot web topics in my country. Can you imagine that readers in my country complicated this divination method even more, they starts to summarize cards numbers which they got during reading and later divide it by number of cards they used and the number they got is "Summary Card" -  for them determing whole reading! Thats ridicolous! I don't know if you have spotted that method, maybe even in this forum there are some readers who use it but come on..     (I dont read every topic).

[…]

 

I don't know which method you're referring to exactly, but there is a traditional spread called the French Cross where the summarising technique comes into play. Using only the trumps of the Tarot de Marseille, you add together the numbers of the first four cards and place the card with the resulting number in the middle as a quintessential card. Because – why not?

 

Regarding the more essential message of your post, I understand your aversion (at least that's how I'm perceiving it) to the modification or manipulation of a valid, functioning system. The thing is, people just like to do that. Be it something rather simple, like a divinatory system, or more complex, like genetic material – when people have the means to, they will play around and remix the matter of interest to their liking or to aid their search. It's human nature.

 

[MrMole]

I don't use reversals for 2 reasons. a) it could be too tempting to take, say the, 10 Swords, and place it upside down in the pack...tut tut. b) I have a habit of going though my cards upright between readings making sure that they are all present and correct, as it were/

[flora]

I use reversals all the time. Its a bit of a learning curve. I started getting into them after I felt confindent enough with the upright meanings.

Cards are like a language to me and adding reversals is like extending your vocabulary.

In my readings elements start to creep in. Getting a hang for elemental dignities will be the next learning step when I feel the time has come.

 

Shuffling for reversals is quite easy. I shuffle, flip a few cards, shuffle, flip, shuffle,flip while I focus on my question and stop when feeling there and then draw.

 

Though I should mention that my primary deck is Rider Waite Smith. That's what I feel most comfortably with.