FindYourSovereignty Posted June 4 Posted June 4 With all the discussion around the 3 of Swords, it has me curious what cards others feel most often could represent a DNS experience. I am thinking the 3S, 9S, 10S, maybe the 9W, 10W, and possibly the 5P and the 5C. Obviously context is everything. I am curious if there are cards that clue you into that energy.
DanielJUK Posted June 4 Posted June 4 I've moved this to Individual Card Meanings where it seems to fit better 🧛♂️ (it's a smiley face on topic)
Chariot Posted June 5 Posted June 5 (edited) I'm not religious. For me, the "dark night of the soul" is a phase of deep spiritual crisis or emotional turmoil. I would add extreme worry, fear, and dread to that. All in all ...it's not an event. It's something that takes place inside a person. It can be related to an event, of course ...but not always. I think the RWS depiction of 9 of Swords illustrates this perfectly. A woman is unable to sleep and is in deep distress because of threats she feels are hanging over her. She is alone. It is indeed a dark night for her soul. For me, the 9 of Swords IS the 'dark night of the soul.' It's about how somebody reacts to an event or situation—real OR imagined. Their suffering is real—but it may be based on groundless or exaggerated fear. It's very real to them at the time, though. I relate very much to that card, as I am a worrier. Realising that what I am afraid of or worrying about may not actually happen, or might not be as bad as I expect it to be, is sometimes a help. This is why I can derive comfort from this card, at times. When it turns up in a reading, it's telling me that while I'm worried, I might not need to be. It's about my state of mind at the time. How I'm seeing an event or circumstance. In some respects, this 9 of Swords card is related to The Moon. The Moon shines a light, but a relatively dim one. It's very easy to see things in a distorted way in the semi-dark and be terrified by what you think these things are. Once daylight dawns, you realise that shapeless, flapping THING you didn't dare walk past isn't a supernatural being, but actually somebody's bedsheet that got caught on a fence post. So all the fears and worry you built up because you couldn't see properly was groundless. But the fear was real—and not necessarily foolish. Bad things do actually creep up in the dark, don't they? For me, the dark night of the soul is what people experience, inside their heads, when they believe something very bad is happening and don't know what to do about it or how to process it. It can be a brief period or one that goes on for a long time. Very debilitating when that happens. You can emerge from that period feeling relief at knowing you're okay after all, or even changing your ways or how you intend to proceed in future. However, that dark depression can also persist and/or re-occur. Not a pleasant thing to experience. Edited June 5 by Chariot
FindYourSovereignty Posted June 5 Author Posted June 5 Thank you for sharing, @Chariot. This resonates with me. 3 hours ago, Chariot said: All in all ...it's not an event. It's something that takes place inside a person. It can be related to an event, of course ...but not always. I think the RWS depiction of 9 of Swords illustrates this perfectly. A woman is unable to sleep and is in deep distress because of threats she feels are hanging over her. She is alone. It is indeed a dark night for her soul. I agree that it in and of itself is not an event. Often, it appears with many I've spoken with, to be triggered by an event, but I don't feel that part is required though. 3 hours ago, Chariot said: For me, the 9 of Swords IS the 'dark night of the soul.' It's about how somebody reacts to an event or situation—real OR imagined. Their suffering is real—but it may be based on groundless or exaggerated fear. It's very real to them at the time, though. It does feel real and, imo, the reality of it continues in the mind. 3 hours ago, Chariot said: In some respects, this 9 of Swords card is related to The Moon. The Moon shines a light, but a relatively dim one. It's very easy to see things in a distorted way in the semi-dark and be terrified by what you think these things are. Once daylight dawns, you realise that shapeless, flapping THING you didn't dare walk past isn't a supernatural being, but actually somebody's bedsheet that got caught on a fence post. So all the fears and worry you built up because you couldn't see properly was groundless. But the fear was real—and not necessarily foolish. Bad things do actually creep up in the dark, don't they? Insightful relationship between these two cards. 4 hours ago, Chariot said: For me, the dark night of the soul is what people experience, inside their heads, when they believe something very bad is happening and don't know what to do about it or how to process it. It can be a brief period or one that goes on for a long time. Very debilitating when that happens. You can emerge from that period feeling relief at knowing you're okay after all, or even changing your ways or how you intend to proceed in future. However, that dark depression can also persist and/or re-occur. Not a pleasant thing to experience. Edited 3 hours ago by Chariot This is exactly my understanding of DNS for people in my life with mental illness. They have many tools and techniques to support them now, but, it can come back u expectedly at any time. I really appreciate your reply.
Rose Lalonde Posted June 5 Posted June 5 6 hours ago, Chariot said: In some respects, this 9 of Swords card is related to The Moon. The Moon shines a light, but a relatively dim one. It's very easy to see things in a distorted way in the semi-dark and be terrified by what you think these things are. Once daylight dawns, you realise that shapeless, flapping THING you didn't dare walk past isn't a supernatural being, but actually somebody's bedsheet that got caught on a fence post. So all the fears and worry you built up because you couldn't see properly was groundless. But the fear was real—and not necessarily foolish. Bad things do actually creep up in the dark, don't they? Great point. What you said reminds me of Waite's description of this card in Pictorial Key: "The path between the towers is the issue into the unknown. The dog and wolf are the fears of the natural mind in the presence of that place of exit, when there is only reflected light to guide it." And: "It illuminates our animal nature, types of which are represented below--the dog, the wolf and that which comes up out of the deeps, the nameless and hideous tendency which is lower than the savage beast." I know not everyone's into astrology in tarot, but I can't help but add that I think it's important that the actual moon corresponds to the Priestess (and Waite has lots of positive things to say about that), while Pisces corresponds to the Moon card. So even in that respect, it's a card of illusion and misdirection. On 6/5/2025 at 12:33 AM, FindYourSovereignty said: I am thinking the 3S, 9S, 10S, maybe the 9W, 10W, and possibly the 5P and the 5C. The only one on your list that I don't associate with a DNS is the 9W, likely because I read Thothy decks more. Crowley calls it Strength in flexibility, and "Change is stability" It does require that we remain responsive and willing to go with whatever comes though, so that's tricky. -- Out of curiosity, I just looked at Waite's description, and I see why you added it: "The card signifies strength in opposition. If attacked, the person will meet an onslaught boldly; and his build shews, that he may prove a formidable antagonist. With this main significance there are all its possible adjuncts--delay, suspension, adjournment."
Chariot Posted June 5 Posted June 5 (edited) 59 minutes ago, Rose Lalonde said: I know not everyone's into astrology in tarot, but I can't help but add that I think it's important that the actual moon corresponds to the Priestess (and Waite has lots of positive things to say about that), while Pisces corresponds to the Moon card. So even in that respect, it's a card of illusion and misdirection. I particularly like this insight. I am a 'moon sign' (Cancer) but I don't quite relate to the moon either as subconscious knowledge OR as a perpetrator of illusion. I do like the moon, and feel its pull in a physical/mental sense ...I sometimes feel quite energised without knowing why ...then 'oh, it's a full moon' ...but it doesn't really create illusions for me, or any subconscious insight. (Just makes me want to jump around and act goofy like a March hare!) But I do associate Pisces with being led astray, thinking something is real, when it's not. I don't actually regard The Moon card as a 'dark night of the soul' card itself, but it can certainly lead a person to that dark, unhappy state of mind, if the person is susceptible to its influence. For me, The Moon card usually tells me I'm not seeing things as they are, or I don't have all the information I need to proceed—but if I wait till dawn, all will be revealed. The Moon upright is just a 'wait a bit' card for me. Things are still to be revealed. Reversed, it means things are finally coming clear. .......... Another card that can be related to 'dark night of the soul' for me is the 10 of Swords ...but only when it's reversed. Reversed it means bad things are happening (outwith my control), and the worst is yet to come. Waiting for that to happen can engulf me in worry. However, upright, the 10 of Swords means the worst has already happened, and things will start to improve. It was bad while it lasted, but the worst is over. So it's actually a card I like to get in certain circumstances—but I sure don't like getting the reversed version! Edited June 5 by Chariot
FindYourSovereignty Posted June 5 Author Posted June 5 (edited) 58 minutes ago, Rose Lalonde said: The only one on your list that I don't associate with a DNS is the 9W, likely because I read Thothy decks more. Crowley calls it Strength in flexibility, and "Change is stability" It does require that we remain responsive and willing to go with whatever comes though, so that's tricky. -- Out of curiosity, "The card signifies strength in opposition. If attacked, the person will meet an onslaught boldly; and his build shews, that he may prove a formidable antagonist. With this main significance there are all its possible adjuncts--delay, suspension, adjournment." Yes, this is why added it and I went back and forth on it several times. Maybe it is more so the combination of any of these cards coming together in a reading that hints at a dns experience. 58 minutes ago, Rose Lalonde said: I read Thothy decks more. Crowley calls it Strength in flexibility, and "Change is stability" It does require that we remain responsive and willing to go with whatever comes though, so that's tricky. I am really enjoying learning the Thoth deck and the different perspective taken with the cards. It increases the depth of possibilities for me for sure. Thank you for sharing. Edited June 5 by FindYourSovereignty
FindYourSovereignty Posted June 5 Author Posted June 5 1 hour ago, Rose Lalonde said: I know not everyone's into astrology in tarot, but I can't help but add that I think it's important that the actual moon corresponds to the Priestess (and Waite has lots of positive things to say about that), while Pisces corresponds to the Moon card. So even in that respect, it's a card of illusion and misdirection. This is a good reminder. I am a Moon Child and yet, the descriptions of the Moon card in tarot resonates so much more to my Pisces dad. 11 minutes ago, Chariot said: I don't regard The Moon card as a 'dark night of the soul' card, but it can certainly lead a person to that dark, unhappy state of mind, if the person is susceptible to its influence. For me, The Moon card usually tells me I'm not seeing things as they are, or I don't have all the information I need to proceed—but if I wait till dawn, all will be revealed. The Moon upright is just a 'wait a bit' card for me. Things are still to be revealed. Reversed, it means things are finally coming clear. I don't consider this a dns card either, nor would I think that if it came up together with the other possible dns cards. I am feeling that the 9S combined with one or more of tne other cards might lead in this direction. Or at least indicate a possibility. Still thinking on all of this. 12 minutes ago, Chariot said: Another card that can be related to 'dark night of the soul' for me is the 10 of Swords ...but only when it's reversed. Reversed it means bad things are happening (outwith my control), and the worst is yet to come. Waiting for that to happen can engulf me in worry. However, upright, the 10 of Swords means the worst has already happened, and things will start to improve. So it's actually a card I like to get in certain circumstances. The worst is over. But I sure don't like getting the reversed version! To me, it feels like the 9S experience got worse if moving on to the 10S reversed.
Chariot Posted June 5 Posted June 5 (edited) 1 hour ago, FindYourSovereignty said: This is a good reminder. I am a Moon Child and yet, the descriptions of the Moon card in tarot resonates so much more to my Pisces dad. I don't consider this a dns card either, nor would I think that if it came up together with the other possible dns cards. I am feeling that the 9S combined with one or more of tne other cards might lead in this direction. Or at least indicate a possibility. Still thinking on all of this. To me, it feels like the 9S experience got worse if moving on to the 10S reversed. Yes, I can see how the emotional state of the 9 of Swords could get really bad if it is followed by the 10 of Swords reversed. I'd have to see the reading in context to be sure, but yes, indeed. Again, the 9 of Swords, in my view, is how a person is thinking and feeling. If they are worried about an actual bad situation getting worse ...yes, that can really be awful. (As the old saying goes, just because you are paranoid doesn't mean nobody means you harm. Somebody may well be out to get you! Paranoia can certainly be justified, at times. So can experiencing the dark night of the soul, as depicted in the 9 of Swords.) I find that being stuck in limbo waiting for an life-changing problem outwith my control to finally be resolved, can lead me to this state of mind. I do heartily hate limbo! Probably why I feel The Chariot is my favourite card. I like to be in control of my vehicle and know where I'm going. I don't want to control others, but I do want control over my own circumstances. And when I don't have that control ...9 of Swords skids into view. Again, the 9 of Swords' fears and negative feelings might be warranted—or not. Just depends, I guess. Good to keep in mind, though, that being frightened or worried doesn't necessarily mean something bad is actually happening 'out there.' Examine the situation as rationally as you can, and with any luck, excessive negativity might be softened a bit. Edited June 5 by Chariot
Rose Lalonde Posted June 5 Posted June 5 1 hour ago, FindYourSovereignty said: Maybe it is more so the combination of any of these cards coming together in a reading that hints at a dns experience. Yes, cards in combination! If the 9S came up with the Moon, for me the latter would increase the sense of paranoia and not knowing what to trust. But the Moon with the 2 of Wands, 6 of Cups, etc. is very different.
FindYourSovereignty Posted June 5 Author Posted June 5 1 hour ago, Rose Lalonde said: Yes, cards in combination! If the 9S came up with the Moon, for me the latter would increase the sense of paranoia and not knowing what to trust. But the Moon with the 2 of Wands, 6 of Cups, etc. is very different. Yes, exactly.
Recommended Posts