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Ciro kipper titles compared to mystical kipper , from atf


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I now have the mystical kipper here in Canada. the author of the little white book urban trosch says he kept the original titles as they have been like for a 100 years and out of respect for the original titles.

ciro added 3 cards to balance out of the kipper however they can not be compared.


mystical kipper ====ciro kipper

1. main person ====main male

2. main person ====main female

3. marriage card ====marriage

4. meetings ====courtship

5. good gentleman ====mature man

6. good lady ====mature lady

7. pleasant letter ====message

8.false person ====false person

9. a change ====change

10.journey ====journey

11. gaining a lot of money ====sudden wealth

12. rich girl ====privileged lady

13. rich good gentleman ====wealthy gentleman

14. sad news ====message of concern

15. success in love ====lovers

16. his thoughts ====thoughts

17. receiving a gift ====gift

18.a little a child ====child

19. bereveament ====coffin

20.house ====house

21. living room ====family room

22. military person ====official person

23. court ====court house

24 theft ====thief

25 high honors ====high honour

26. great happiness ====great fortune

27. unexpected money ====unexpected income

28. expectation ====expectation

29. prison ====imprisonment

30. court person ====judication

31.short illness ====bad health

32. grief and adversity ====despair

33. gloomy thoughts ====concern

34. work, occupation ====occupation

35. a long way ====pathway

36.hope. big water ====distant horizons.

37. na ====poverty

38 na ====toil and labour

39 na ====community


so not to much has changed just based on the title some things stand out.


courtship and meetings in the meetings card they meet for the first time,, courtship indicates they are more serious.

sad news is more well sadder then just message of concern which could be more open ended.

success in love is more definite in ciro version because obviously if they are not courting, or married or just met but they are successful in love they must be lovers.

bereavement to coffin sounds lenormand oriented, perhaps it could of been grief

theft means that it will happen,, thief is a little varied meaning the person is attempting to steal or did.


my peeve is great happiness to me means yay.. well great fortune means it is only related to money. but then in the picture it shows money in mystical (no clue what a really old kipper image looks like ) so I think great happiness if I was a designer would somehow be more focused on the happiness aspect. It must of been paradox or perhaps in the day and age money really did buy happiness.


ciro did say in the book he found the cards to be too positive as short illness indicates quick recovery but bad health means longer term.


grief and adversity and despair is a little bit difference in shades. I like despair better.


gloomy thoughts to me makes more sense then concern,

was depression a word back in the 1800s I doubt it.


I like long way better then pathways it is more obiously what it is supposed to be as pathways could mean more choice then long.


hope, big water and distant horizons is a little different , perphaps I would of liked distant hopes , or big horizons lol.


anyhow in the end there isn't anything radically different so the original kipper titles changed between ciro and mystical kipper. perhaps due to the easy access of the ciro kipper in north America (at least in Canada here by online ordering ) the ciro kipper titles will eventually become better known except where the kipper comes from

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