Guest libra Posted October 25, 2018 Posted October 25, 2018 In a similar vein to the recent Tower thread - or, rather, the direction it was occasionally going - let's talk about the cards that challenge us. The Tower, The Devil, Death, 3 of Swords, etc etc. Let's talk about how we experience them in our lives, what lessons they bring, what growth comes from the experiences! Feel free to jump on with whatever thoughts you have about any card that challenges you, or to continue the conversations started by someone else!
Guest libra Posted October 25, 2018 Posted October 25, 2018 The Hierophant is one that I've had a lot of issues with. Having grown up with vaguely Christian things in my life, this card in the traditional imagery seems to go that way. But with this idea of an almighty God, well I couldn't reconcile that with how horrible the world seemed to me, the crap that I lived through and saw others struggling through. And the leaders in the religious areas were very often just... not good, in my eyes. The Hierophant looked like a symbol of those same close minded, hurtful people and I just could never wrap my head around liking that card and that idea. And then, my Soul Card is The High Priestess. It's so easy to juxtapose the 2 of them and The Hierophant always fell short. But, well imma just copy-pasta my thoughts from Instagram a whole back! Because the way I stated to see him changed from a leader of a broken, damaging system, to moreof a curator of wisdom and that has really helped me to work with the energy, rather than struggle against it! ~~~ I’m not going to lie - like many tarot readers, when I’m seeking a spiritual leader from the Tarot, I tend to have a strong preference towards The High Priestess over The Heirophant! I’m going to first talk about who The High Priestess is to me. I’m partial to her energy, as she represents my Soul in my birth card set. But, stepping out of my personal preference, The High Priestess feels to me like someone that you seek out, that you find when you need one-on-one guidance into the spiritual realms. And, if you are lucky enough to find her … well, just know that she won’t hold back when you’ve asked for information. You’ll get the truth, all of it, from the divine to the dark shadows. To me, The Hierophant is nearly the opposite of that. He’s a public figure, one that may actually have a connection to the divine like The High Priestess does, but who picks & chooses what information to share, based on his own agenda. His teachings don’t come as a one-on-one personal level, but as him making proclamations for the masses, hence why his messages may be censored a bit before delivery - he’s looking to reach as many people as possible, so he needs to curate the message accordingly. The High Priestess is harder to access at first, but you’ll only ever get the truth from her. The Hierophant is more in the public eye, but I find his messages may be truthful, yet … rarely the whole truth. Tell me, do you feel the same way? How do you read the similarities & differences between 2 spiritual leaders within the tarot deck?
Guest libra Posted October 25, 2018 Posted October 25, 2018 I'm also just going to bring on over my previous post on The Tower, as an invitation for anyone else who wants to chat about their thoughts and experiences with this tough card! ~~~ One aspect that is pretty much personal to me, as far as I can tell, is that I've had a pretty rough life. I've gotten used to "being strong", of needing to power through crap and not let it be seen that I'm suffering. I get a dark card like The Tower or the 3 of Swords or Death and it's like... Permission. Permission to recognize that things are bloody hard, things are crap. Sometimes I'm not okay and things are not okay and pulling these cards tells me that THAT is okay. When you're used to always putting on a facade that things are great, it can be so cathartic to just see that it is all coming down and it's not all just in my head. And then The Tower in specific. The sweet chaos of The Tower. In my personal readings, The Tower has started to talk about my own internal barriers. It's usually talking about how I walled myself in to keep myself safe... But I outgrew those walls, and now I'm stuck inside, can't grow, can't connect with people. The Tower is that terrifying and liberating breaking point. It doesn't come up often for me, but when it does, you bet I'm saying "bring it on." You can also bet that I'm crying,and that I'm just waiting for The Star that follows, but also, yes there is a part of me that's happy that those walls are coming down. Here's a poem I wrote about that, The Devil-the Tower-the Star sequence. Sweet Child, You escaped the chains of the Devil only to build up walls of your own. From the darkest pit you climbed Up and up and up. But don’t you see? It’s as lonely and cold confined at the top As it was to be trapped at the bottom. You only wanted to see the stars once more But you built yourself into a lightning rod. Never fear, Sweet Child. Nature abhors a straight line. She will tear your walls down for you. She will leave you naked and alone. She will leave you free.
Grizabella Posted October 25, 2018 Posted October 25, 2018 I don't remember the quote exactly but the most exact meaning I've ever seen for the Heirophant was in Ciro's book that goes with his first Tarot deck. It said that the Heirophant is the person who tells us what the Universe is all about. I'm not saying his exact words, but that makes all the sense in the world to me. The High Preistess is both my soul and personality cards and she's more what I believe like, too. She knows all the secrets but she keeps them to herself. She's not going to tell you what to believe but if you seek her wisdom, she can be expected to share what she knows.
Guest libra Posted October 25, 2018 Posted October 25, 2018 I don't remember the quote exactly but the most exact meaning I've ever seen for the Heirophant was in Ciro's book that goes with his first Tarot deck. It said that the Heirophant is the person who tells us what the Universe is all about. I'm not saying his exact words, but that makes all the sense in the world to me. The High Preistess is both my soul and personality cards and she's more what I believe like, too. She knows all the secrets but she keeps them to herself. She's not going to tell you what to believe but if you seek her wisdom, she can be expected to share what she knows. Ooh, if you ever happen to be near your computer with the book at any point, I wouldn't mind hearing the quote from it! I definitely still struggle with The Hierophant, so I love getting other views to add to my base of good stuff!
Guest libra Posted October 26, 2018 Posted October 26, 2018 When it comes to Death, I've got a lotta Feels about the card and how it's treated these days. Especially considering that it was my Year Card last year, so it was on my mind a lot. I think as tarot readers, we all see how sensationalized it is in the media, where you pull Death and everyone goes all pale and then someone dies... So then, we kinda back pedal and we pull it and go "Nonono, don't panic, it's not about REAL Death! It's just transformation! A fresh start!" and let me tell you, I railed HARD against that for a while. I was gung-ho about giving Death the respect it deserved, how it may not be about a literal physical Death, but going the opposite direction and saying it was about a new beginning was going Too Far. I wanted people to be able to pull the card and really feel into the pain that even a metaphorical Death can bring, to be able to mourn the loss of things, even when it's their time to be lost. When it came to Death nurturing new growth, I felt like it was more like composting - something dies, and needs time to decompose before it really can nurture something else. I really felt like the transformative nature of the card wasn't being understood to the level it could be, that the actual Death portion was being glossed over. But I then I realized that when I do lose something in myself, if I don't consider what that void will be filled with, chances are pretty good that more of the same will fill it, simply due to the ease of fitting what was there before into the same spot. So healing and growth that comes with Death does need to have a balance in my life - honouring any feelings that come up with loss, because ignoring those feelings isn't healthy, but also consciously choosing what I want to have in my life in that place. Death has become an opportunity to rewire myself, so to speak.
Rose Lalonde Posted October 26, 2018 Posted October 26, 2018 A lot of my connection to these cards has to do with context. When I pull the 10 of Swords for a daily draw on an average day in which the closest I come to the meaning is seeing sharp knives lined up in the kitchen drawer, or getting cut off by a fellow driver, it can make me smile at the overkill. I mean, how many swords does it take to stab that guy?! It's like one of those 'How many people does it take to screw in a lightbulb' jokes. It just reminds me not to create drama. On the other hand, shortly after my mother died years ago, when I drew the 3 of Swords I took great comfort in it. It reflected what I felt (much as you said for The Tower, libra[/member] ), and reminded me I'm not alone, that all of us deal with pain and loss at some point. And from that there's the possibility to feel empathy for each other.
Guest libra Posted October 26, 2018 Posted October 26, 2018 A lot of my connection to these cards has to do with context. When I pull the 10 of Swords for a daily draw on an average day in which the closest I come to the meaning is seeing sharp knives lined up in the kitchen drawer, or getting cut off by a fellow driver, it can make me smile at the overkill. I mean, how many swords does it take to stab that guy?! It's like one of those 'How many people does it take to screw in a lightbulb' jokes. It just reminds me not to create drama. I do agree the context in these cards really make or break how I feel about them! The 10 of Swords tend to be pretty harsh at me, like it's the card that comes out to tell me off when I'm, like you mentioned, being dramatic. My fiancé likes to ask "but did you DIIIIIE?" which feels in line with the energy of the 10 of Swords to me. On the other hand, shortly after my mother died years ago, when I drew the 3 of Swords I took great comfort in it. It reflected what I felt (much as you said for The Tower, libra[/member] ), and reminded me I'm not alone, that all of us deal with pain and loss at some point. And from that there's the possibility to feel empathy for each other. The 3 of Swords is one of my favorite cards as well! It's one that I'll dig around to see before buying a deck. It's a reminder to me to keep allowing myself to feel, even if it hurts. The more pain I'm able to feel just stretches to allow more joy as well. Things get scary when I don't feel the pain of the 3 of Swords, because then I also am apathetic to the good in life. Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts and experiences!
DanielJUK Posted October 26, 2018 Posted October 26, 2018 I am fine with the Tower and other difficult Majors, my challenging cards are the Swords suit! I so relate to the Cups suit and it's like my opposite! I know people who could represent the Swords Courts cards and I see them as that and also I read for other people and can understand the Swords fine for them, but in my own personal readings, Swords are a challenge! I find them hard to relate to for me because they seem so different to me! (although this probably means it's my shadow side and I need to accept and work on it >:D )
Thoughtful Posted October 28, 2018 Posted October 28, 2018 l love the High Priestess card, she is so mysterious and enigmatic. She will talk and tell her secrets. But l have always had issues with reading the Hierophant card, and l see here l am not alone. This card is the one that stops me in my tracks, it is always a challenge for me. l don't why as l have nothing against religion, Popes, church leaders and the like.
Guest Night Shade Posted October 29, 2018 Posted October 29, 2018 I think the card that challenges me the most is the 9 of Swords. I can put some kind of positive spin on all of the other cards, but I can't find anything positive about this one. It reminds me of this horrible feeling I sometimes get when I've finally gotten some sleep after many a restless night. I wake up feeling peaceful, maybe even cheerful. Then I suddenly remember what I'm going through, and all of that peace comes crashing down. Experiencing that bit of serenity, then having it swept away, leaves me feeling more hopeless and depressed than I did to start with. I guess that's what this card represents most to me - hopelessness and despair. I can't find anything good about that. Now, The Moon, which many people find challenging, has always been one of my favorite cards. My attraction to this card has more to do with its imagery than its meaning. The path between the two towers, under the full moon, makes me think of a spiritual initiation; like if you walk that path, you'll become one with the magic and mysteries of the night. This brings me to a point I was going to make on the previous thread. I think that people's attraction to certain cards largely depends on the deck that they're using. Some decks portray the difficult cards much more pleasantly than others. For example, in the Celtic Dragon Tarot, the Death card features a dragon shedding its skin, emphasizing the transformation aspect of the card; the dragon's becoming an even stronger and better version of herself. Also in Celtic Dragon, the Moon card shows a dragon dancing under a full moon, which is more evocative of moonlit rituals than deception and illusion. Finally. on the Tower card, the dragons are ripping down the tower themselves. They're taking the initiative to break down the strongholds that are holding them back and ruining their lives. I guess people's reactions to challenging cards ultimately comes down to a combination of what they see in the cards, their personal meanings for the cards, and how these relate to the experiences they've been through.
Guest libra Posted October 31, 2018 Posted October 31, 2018 I am fine with the Tower and other difficult Majors, my challenging cards are the Swords suit! I so relate to the Cups suit and it's like my opposite! I know people who could represent the Swords Courts cards and I see them as that and also I read for other people and can understand the Swords fine for them, but in my own personal readings, Swords are a challenge! I find them hard to relate to for me because they seem so different to me! (although this probably means it's my shadow side and I need to accept and work on it >:D ) It's so funny, I'm very comfortable with the Swords in general. Their lessons just make so much sense to me! I tend to find the Wands most oblique when trying to read.
Guest libra Posted October 31, 2018 Posted October 31, 2018 This brings me to a point I was going to make on the previous thread. I think that people's attraction to certain cards largely depends on the deck that they're using. Some decks portray the difficult cards much more pleasantly than others. For example, in the Celtic Dragon Tarot, the Death card features a dragon shedding its skin, emphasizing the transformation aspect of the card; the dragon's becoming an even stronger and better version of herself. Also in Celtic Dragon, the Moon card shows a dragon dancing under a full moon, which is more evocative of moonlit rituals than deception and illusion. Finally. on the Tower card, the dragons are ripping down the tower themselves. They're taking the initiative to break down the strongholds that are holding them back and ruining their lives. I guess people's reactions to challenging cards ultimately comes down to a combination of what they see in the cards, their personal meanings for the cards, and how these relate to the experiences they've been through. This whole thing, it's just so true! And I think that's why I really love tarot. It's not about "This card means THIS every time." It's a conglomeration of those old, known meanings, the meaning to the artist, the meaning to the reader. It means that EVERY reader has value, because each of us experiences things in our own way and brings something new to the table!
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