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'Fall Out' Shuffling


stephanelli
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It seems like I'm seeing the "Fall Out Method" or "Jumpers" of getting cards for a reading a lot lately, and it got me wondering a few things...

 

If you use this method:

- why do you use this method? 

- how do you know you aren't just shuffling the cards sloppily?

- does it not confuse the reading to have an unknown quantity of cards at each position?  (Say I was doing a Celtic Cross, it seems it'll be far less confusing to have 1 card for each position that I can then relate to other positions rather than say 2, 3 or even 4 cards for a position that I then need to try and relate to other positions.)

 

Personally, I don't use this method.  I use my hands a lot, my hands get pretty tired from the activities I do.  When my hands are more tired, my card shuffling is much sloppier because my muscles aren't working at their optimum level so I drop more cards.

 

Anyway, I'm intrigued by this method even though I know I'll never use it and want to know why you think it works for you if you use it.

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katrinka

I don't use it, I'm just here to note that actual jumpers are something that should only happen rarely and are purely accidental. You're shuffling, a card jumps out, you note it and go on with the shuffle, cut, etc. It's kind of boggling to me that people are using it as a "method" now. What would a client think of a reader dropping cards all over the place? It sounds pretty unprofessional.

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I actually had this discussion the other day! I am a newbie so was asking about if people used them etc. I did a daily pull abs four cards fell and if I am honest they confused my one card pull and made no sense. But I love the Queen of Pentacles and when I am having a hard time or struggling with things she always pops up in my readings and sometimes on a rare occasion she has jumped out. So I do believe sometimes cards jump so that you get a little extra knowledge of just as a comfort. But then also I think sometimes it’s just sloppy shuffling. 
 

Also I got a tarot reading and the 5 of pentacles came up about me buying a house. We then proceeded to use a different deck and nothing came up about the house and we were discussing it as the reader was shuffling and what popped out but the 5 of pentacles almost as a I am still here listen to the message. 
 

so I think it really does depend on the situation and context. 

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I think it was Dan aka Umbrae that said "peek but don't dwell" on them. If I have a jumper,  I'll pay attention a little bit not much. I'll stick it back in the deck  and keep shuffling. If it pops back up in the reading,  then it was meant to be.

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Fallout shuffling? It's a new one on me. Where does this come from and does being drunk help? 

 

In a somewhat similar vein, maybe I remember Jodorowsky used to fling a pack to the floor, then perform his reading by picking through the resultant chaos.  

 

It's all just random processes, I suppose.

Edited by devin
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Its great to see all these interesting thoughts on it!

 

For me, jumpers have always felt like sloppy shuffling to me.  I simply pick them up and put them back in.  I don't even make a note of what card it is.

It is interesting to read how different people deal with them though.

 

I guess it's what works for other readers!

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It wonder if it has origins from Cleromancy where you cast (or throw down) bones, sticks or stones for divination. Some methods give importance to the positions of the items on the floor, whether they fall within an inner circle or not or how near to each other. Or just someone clumsy with big hands shuffling like me 🙂

 

If you believe the idea that the cards that come up are fated in a way and that is the answer to your reading, I guess it doesn't matter how you use it. Everyone should find their own method that works for them. But I am not sure just throwing all my cards in the air works for me. I do set an intention when shuffling that the cards I deal at the top are the answer or message. Although I do read jumpers in some circumstances because I think it's fated as part of the message. I guess if you get an accurate reading from it, it works for you!

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I don't use it but I do look at what card or cards it was.  And I shuffle them back in.   After a good healthy shuffle and I lay cards down and the jumper is still there?  Which happens about 1/4th of the time?

Okay, then I believe the universe is trying to tell me something important and pay attention.  😛

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katrinka
4 hours ago, DanielJUK said:

It wonder if it has origins from Cleromancy where you cast (or throw down) bones, sticks or stones for divination. Some methods give importance to the positions of the items on the floor, whether they fall within an inner circle or not or how near to each other.


But why not use something actually intended for that? There's no shortage of charm sets available that correspond to Tarot or Lenormand. Or just use runes, bones, stones, or some combination of these. Or design and make your own. When you're done, you can just swoop them back into their container rather than playing 78 Pickup.

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euripides

If I'm doing a full spread, I do a spread. I shuffle fairly carefully but occasionally one will fall or just mis-align noticeably, so I might pay it attention. Occasionally two, and if I was only going to draw one, I'll bring it into the reading too.  It's not like I'm dropping a dozen cards and trying to make a spread from them.  It doesn't happen all the time, either. It works for me; if it doesn't work for you, don't do it.

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15 hours ago, stephanelli said:

It seems like I'm seeing the "Fall Out Method" or "Jumpers" of getting cards for a reading a lot lately, and it got me wondering a few things...

 

If you use this method:

- why do you use this method? 

- how do you know you aren't just shuffling the cards sloppily?

- does it not confuse the reading to have an unknown quantity of cards at each position?  (Say I was doing a Celtic Cross, it seems it'll be far less confusing to have 1 card for each position that I can then relate to other positions rather than say 2, 3 or even 4 cards for a position that I then need to try and relate to other positions.)

 

Personally, I don't use this method.  I use my hands a lot, my hands get pretty tired from the activities I do.  When my hands are more tired, my card shuffling is much sloppier because my muscles aren't working at their optimum level so I drop more cards.

 

Anyway, I'm intrigued by this method even though I know I'll never use it and want to know why you think it works for you if you use it.

 

I rarely have jumpers, but when I do, I do pay attention to it, unless of course its say, more then 2 cards maximum!  3 or more cards falling out would tell me I was being a sloppy shuffler! 

 

However, when I am reading in person, I allow my customer to do the shuffling, and sometimes they do drop more then 2 or 3 cards.  At that point, I gather the cards together, hand them back to the customer to include with the rest of the deck and shuffle one more time.  Sometimes, since there are 78 of these cards to shuffle, I tell the customer to put the cards face down on the table and just move them around (shuffling them).  When they feel 'done', then I have them gather the cards together again and hand them to me-still face down.  Having them shuffle the cards facing down on a table generally helps with not having any jumpers.

 

When I am doing a reading for someone via phone or email, and I am doing the shuffling of the cards, if one or 2 drop out, I will make note of what jumpers came out and add that to the reading.  But they do go right back into the deck to be shuffled more--and with more care too.  3 or more, I really would think it was just me not paying attention to the shuffling and I would just gather them up and put them back into the deck without even adding them into the reading. 

 

If I am reading with a spread, I do not consider the jumper(s) as a part of that spread--just a separate added information for the customer.  Its amazing to me how often they really do make sense to the customer.

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Pretzel

I use this method. To answer your questions:

 

- why do you use this method? 

Initially I had issues with 'all' the cards being in the right order for a larger spread. If I got the 'ping' to stop shuffling, would all 10 cards really be in the right order? Probably... but I kept second guessing myself when I thought a certain card didn't make sense - I guess that's was a beginner's issue at the time.

 

- how do you know you aren't just shuffling the cards sloppily?

It feels different when they jump or are meant to come out. There are times I've dropped a large portion of the deck, but I can easily tell that was my clumsiness. 

 

- does it not confuse the reading to have an unknown quantity of cards at each position?  (Say I was doing a Celtic Cross, it seems it'll be far less confusing to have 1 card for each position that I can then relate to other positions rather than say 2, 3 or even 4 cards for a position that I then need to try and relate to other positions.)

Quite the opposite. I've found that often I've gotten 2 or 3 cards for a position, and while at first I thought it was a pain, I quickly realised those 2 or 3 cards told a complete story for me. It's as if the universe/spirit knows I won't 'get it' from 1 card. That's actually been quite uncanny for me. Of course sometimes I really just get one card.

Edited by Pretzel
bolded the questions for ease of reading
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Dixiechick80

Actually, I have used this method of shuffling and can easily detect whether the fallen card belongs in the reading. I just get a feeling that it's meant. With that said, I try to keep my shuffling fairly simple and straight forward. No drunken shuffling, unless on purpose 😂

 

Now, with all that said, my newbie mind does wonder if my Spirit guides who are helping, get used to one method or another of shuffling and choosing cards.

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I thought of another reason why I like the 'fall out' method - it helps me with reversals. I could never understand how those who read reversals would flip a number of cards to be reversed - I would feel like I influenced the reversal. I prefer to keep all my cards upright and then if it falls out reversed, in my mind, I feel it was meant to be reversed. This started when I only read uprights and had a card jump out reversed and it got me thinking.

But as Dixiechick80 said... I guess spirit guides know which method we use.

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TheStarOfCups

I use the fall out method when I'm doing readings! I used to not use this method but as I progressed through tarot it's the style that came naturally to me. I trust my deck to push out the cards that are needed for me to understand the reading and it always works well for me. My decks are also very particular sometimes control my hands to pick out the cards that I need. I think that every ody has different relationships with their decks, but with mine they seem to flow well with me when I use this method. Since I use this method all the time, jumpers don't confuse me and are used in my readings.

 

Sometimes my cards let lots of cards fall out but they always direct me to which cards are needed. I'll even say to them "this is too many cards, guys" and they'll show me which card(s) are needed.

 

However, my cards usually respond to me. If I say I want 3 cards, 3 cards will fall out. If cards fall out that aren't needed, I usually won't feel connected to them. So, I just put them back into the deck. A lot of it is just intuition and trusting my decks!

 

Shuffling, and then pulling cards off the top is how I started reading. I think both methods can be useful and recommend trying both! It's a while new feel and in my opinion doing both methods has helped me to bond with my cards a lot.

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Dixiechick80
On 8/14/2021 at 4:52 PM, Wyrdkiss said:

I shuffle vertically, hard, and loudly.  When I have a jumper, which is rare, it really pops. I always set it aside, as it is a fun addition and usually conducive to the reading.

 

I find the jumpers to be kind of fun, actually! Once, I was on the phone talking to my aunt and shuffling my Rebel deck to get a feel for the energy of the deck. My aunt was kind of purging her thoughts (she's in a rough place with the state of the world) and this card literally flew out from my Rebel deck with force and slammed against the wall. Swear to the gods that I wasn't violently shuffling them or anything. Immediately, I knew it was for my aunt. It said she was giving too many f**ks and the proper amount to give would be 0. It was scarily accurate and we both laughed about it. It definitely eased my Aunt's mind for the moment. We ended up moving on to more calming subjects.

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I saw a video on YouTube lately and the lady was using an old deck (used), so it looked like someone who practices with her deck regularly for years.

But each time she was shuffling her cards, they were falling out if I can say 😁

For me who watched this, it just looked like someone who don't know how to shuffle well her cards, it gives an amateurish vibe to be honest, even if it's not the case...

I think this idea was suggested in the thread, but I confirm that it really what it looks like.

 

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katrinka
37 minutes ago, Decan said:

I saw a video on YouTube lately and the lady was using an old deck (used), so it looked like someone who practices with her deck regularly for years.

But each time she was shuffling her cards, they were falling out if I can say 😁

For me who watched this, it just looked like someone who don't know how to shuffle well her cards, it gives an amateurish vibe to be honest, even if it's not the case...

I think this idea was suggested in the thread, but I confirm that it really what it looks like.

 

I agree, in most cases. I would understand if the cause was arthritis or similar, but if your hands work well, use them and enjoy acing perfect shuffles! It gives you a competent, professional quality.
It's possible that lady was a good, experienced reader, we don't know. It's also possible she bought an old beat deck on ebay. If I saw that, I'd wonder.
Better to inspire confidence in your sitters with a good, efficient, capable shuffle. 😉

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Nina from ‘Shuffle tarot’ on YouTube uses this technique. I have seen her ask her deck to only give her the amount of jumpers she needs and if the wrong number pops out she puts them back in and continue shuffling. This method seem to work well for her, she’s read cards for a long time. I’m not sure if her rheumatism is part of why she uses thus method; she has mentioned in the past that her hands are stiff because of it and I believe she has a limited range of motion in her joints. 
 

I too have rheumatism but can shuffle okay with decks that aren’t too big. I have to avoid slippery card stocks though, because cards come flying everywhere for me otherwise 😅 

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For sure there are probably "smart people" who buy an old used deck on eBay 😁

 

Regarding arthritis, yes, naturally I understand, but it's likely better to shuffle the cards very slowly but that they don't fall out; I mean regarding what sitter in front can feel.

Or maybe to riffle-shuffle in this case? I don't know if it's easier when someone has arthrtisis or rheumatism.

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20 minutes ago, Decan said:

For sure there are probably "smart people" who buy an old used deck on eBay 😁

 

Regarding arthritis, yes, naturally I understand, but it's likely better to shuffle the cards very slowly but that they don't fall out; I mean regarding what sitter in front can feel.

Or maybe to riffle-shuffle in this case? I don't know if it's easier when someone has arthrtisis or rheumatism.

I agree. I’d personally find it embarrassing if I dropped cards in front of clients. I only overhand shuffle and that works good for me as long as the deck is not too big. I guess that those who use jumpers explain their methods for their clients prior to the reading so that they know it’s done on purpose, so to speak 😄

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1 hour ago, Raggydoll said:

I agree. I’d personally find it embarrassing if I dropped cards in front of clients. I only overhand shuffle and that works good for me as long as the deck is not too big. I guess that those who use jumpers explain their methods for their clients prior to the reading so that they know it’s done on purpose, so to speak

They likely explained this before, I guess too, because it visually gives "a Tower impression" 😁 that don't put them looking their best, and we know that non verbal language is important.

Just some ideas about this in connection with a video I lately saw and that reminds me this thread I read.

Edited by Decan
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