Ungendering Kings and Queens

[Aguilita_tarot]

(And the rest of the court cards, for that matter)

 

Hi I'm back again, with a topic that I'm not sure has been had in the forums yet. I've struggled with the court cards for a long time, and although I've started understanding them a little more especially recently, I get stumped with differentiating the Queens and Kings mostly because the cards that I've used have always gendered them in obvious or visible ways, which makes it hard for me to remove them from their stereotypical gender roles. What's the difference between the Queens and Kings anyway? I've read about the queen being more nurturing, sympathetic, motherly etc. and the King being more responsible, rational, etc. Are there ways to interpret them to be, I don't know, less gendered or not at all?

 

Are there any decks that don't explicitly gender their cards? Gender neutral or agendered decks? Thanks!

[Rose Lalonde]

You might enjoy this discussion about the difference between Kings/Queens with several takes on gender here.  I'm copying what I wrote ---
 

The Thoth and Thoth inspired Tabula Mundi I read with use the literal acts involved in bringing a child into the world as a metaphor for all acts of creation. So Kings come across as putting their energy out there while Queens receive. But also, Kings have a limited period of usefulness before they roll over and go to sleep, at a time when Queens are just getting started, growing increasingly complex life within and bringing it into the world. -- So if you want a fast fix for a broken water main, you could call a King, but if you want to build a community's water system, you're going to need a Queen.

Everybody has some of both of those characteristics in their personality at different times. I don't read Kings as always male and Queens always female; I tend to associate myself most closely with the Prince of Swords and my husband with the Queen of Cups, both of which fall on our respective birthdays, and also tend to suit us pretty well if I want to use a significator.

 

---  Or you could choose decks with ungendered courts. There are also decks that don't use traditional genders, like Spirit Keeper's 2 male and 2 female Queens and 2 male and 2 female Kings. Or the Numinous Tarot with all genders throughout the court.

 

Edited December 7, 2021 by Rose Lalonde

[katrinka]

It's important to remember the difference between sex and gender as well, in some cases. A trans woman is a woman, and so, a Queen. A trans man is a King or Knight.
Pages have always been gender neutral.

But there are a lot of newer decks that address all of this in various ways:
https://www.google.com/search?q=non+binary+tarot&source=lmns&bih=605&biw=1349&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjU1o35t9L0AhU0gU4HHSY3CE0Q_AUoAHoECAEQAA

 

 

[Aguilita_tarot]

Thank you for the links! I guess what I want is to isolate the cards' meanings away from their perceived genders without the imagery's bias, so I can fill that in depending on the querent. I saw a response about some animal cards generally being ungendered; I do have a deck of animal cards that I've been meaning to use more, it would be great to study those and do the work of isolating their meaning outside of gender.

 

@Rose Lalonde love the water system analogy there, I'm a visual person and that painted a picture very clearly haha I'm reading that forum now so hopefully I'll get more info from it, thanks!

 

I took a look at the link you sent, @katrinka, and saw the 5th spirit tarot deck and love that it's using the traditional titles but expanding the imagery on gender representation, which is really awesome. 

Edited December 7, 2021 by Aguilita_tarot

[katrinka]

Yes, I like their Note on Gender here:

https://www.fifthspirittarot.com/about

 

I think expanding notions of gender is an excellent approach.

[Rose Lalonde]

22 minutes ago, Aguilita_tarot said:

 I guess what I want is to isolate the cards' meanings away from their perceived genders without the imagery's bias, so I can fill that in depending on the querent. I saw a response about some animal cards generally being ungendered; I do have a deck of animal cards that I've been meaning to use more, it would be great to study those and do the work of isolating their meaning outside of gender.

Yes, animal or botanical decks for what you're looking for. I was going to say Transient Light - it's a completely ungendered deck that does include some human figures, but it looks like it's not available anymore? Putting it here in case I'm wrong.

 

Edited December 7, 2021 by Rose Lalonde