Scythe + Mice

[Curiosity]

Hello everyone 🙂

 

I am just beggining to try learning Lenormand. I am reading the Treppner course and also Lenormand thirty six cards (or as you sometimes call it here, Andy's book). I haven't finished either, so I still have several questions. 

 

I have been doing 3 cards and 5 cards readings, and I'm still not sure if I am doing it well, though often the reading seems to make sense. Then I got "bold" and decided to try a GT. I decided beforehand that whatever I got from it, I wouldn't take it too seriously. I mean, I am very much a baby when it comes to Lenormand and I don't want to be scared or intimidated by a wrong reading. Of course, I'm approaching it bit by bit, trying to make some sense of it, but as expected it's all still very unclear. I might create a post about it here, going about it more systematically, but for now I haven't been able to "structure" my reading well enough to do that yet. All this is to say that I am not sure I am posting in the right section. This combination I am asking about is in my GT, but for now I am only asking about the combination itself. Is it okay to post it here?

 

So, the scythe + mice, in this order. The pointy end points to the right, to the mice. I have read that mice take/destroy whatever is to their left while spoiling whatever is to their right. Treppner specifically says that the mice destroy the scythe. So in this case, would they destroy the scythe? She also says that the scythe has a similar effect, and can neutralize negative cards to its right, like the mice here. So in this case, would they cancel each other out? And by cancelling does one mean that it is as if they were never there, like they have no effect at all? Also, in this case, they wouldn't then still have any influence in other cards around them, would they?

 

Andy says that the card following the scythe usually describe what is under threat or describes the danger. Seeing it from this angle, I think maybe the scythe could still neutralize the mice , being the latter what is under threat. Am I getting this right? According to his point of view, would this still be a possibility? Moreover, he adds, the pointy end could actually be describing the danger. In this case, it would be telling me that the danger is in the mice. He also says that the cards to the left of the mice are what is set to be soiled or destroyed, which means they would still destroy the scythe. But then if the mice destroy the scythe, does this (the scythe signaling danger from the mice ) still count? However, he points out that one shouldn't have a false sense of security if the cards flanking the mice are negative, since there's still some kind of loss. So IDK, maybe even if they cancel each other out something is still going to be lost? 

 

As you can see, I am "a bit" confused by this combination and would appreciate any insights!

 

Thanks 🙂

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 26, 2022 by Curiosity
adding missing words

[DanielJUK]

You are absolutely right to post in this area. This section is for discussing individual cards or card combinations for learning. If you want to post a personal reading (not discussing cards in a general way to learn), they need to go in Your Readings. It's easy for us to move stuff around, so don't worry about it 🙂

[Curiosity]

13 minutes ago, DanielJUK said:

You are absolutely right to post in this area. This section is for discussing individual cards or card combinations for learning. If you want to post a personal reading (not discussing cards in a general way to learn), they need to go in Your Readings. It's easy for us to move stuff around, so don't worry about it 🙂

 

Hi @DanielJUK! Thanks for clarifying 🙂 

[joy]

Hey @Curiosityfabulous that you are starting to dive into Lenormand! I still call myself a beginner 🙂  I do agree with Andy here, that the Mice are affecting both sides.

Having said that in a daily reading for example Scythe & Mice could mean : danger comes from pest/infestation. Could be you have a mouse in the house, danger comes from the Mice.

 

That is just my thought hopefully some of the advanced Lenormand Readers will chime in!

But also note this interesting thread:

 

[Curiosity]

3 hours ago, joy said:

ey @Curiosityfabulous that you are starting to dive into Lenormand! I still call myself a beginner 🙂  I do agree with Andy here, that the Mice are affecting both sides.

Having said that in a daily reading for example Scythe & Mice could mean : danger comes from pest/infestation. Could be you have a mouse in the house, danger comes from the Mice.

 

That is just my thought hopefully some of the advanced Lenormand Readers will chime in!

 

Hello Joy! Thanks for helping! So the way you see it they don't cancel each other out? Actually, not even one of them is canceled?

 

3 hours ago, joy said:

But also note this interesting thread:

 

 

 

Thanks for this as well 😊 I just did, but it seems to me that this one is a bit different, since the clover is between scythe and mice, so in this case the clover is affected by both and they don't influence each other in such a direct way. 

Though I read Katrinka saying something that might be more like this case here in one of the replies. She said she likes the reflection in that case, where scythe and mice damage each other, making it seem more short term. That's the kind of logic I was going for here. But maybe there are some cases in which this "mutual damage" doesn't happen, right? 

Edited July 26, 2022 by Curiosity
clarification

[joy]

Hey @Curiosity to be very honest this one is in my opinion a very difficult combination to read at least for me 😆 Also it depends a lot on the context and the cards around. There are some more threads talking about those 2 cards, if you search using the search box you will find them. And hopefully get some useful answers.

[frankie]

Hi Curiosity. 🙂 I'm learning Lenormand as well, but I thought I would share what I've gleaned from my experiences so far and from my understanding of Andy B.'s writings.

 

From what I've understood and seen in my readings, two negative cards amplify each other and do not cancel each other out. IMO, as others have written on this forum before, this also makes sense based on what we see in nature. Can a mouse eat away a scythe? No, but they can soil it.

 

Since you mention that you have Andy's book (I cannot tell you how much I adore it) I'd suggest looking through the beginning of Part Two ("Combining and Reading the Cards Together"), especially the sections on Proximity and Attendance (p. 125-133). I do quite a lot of re-reading myself, and always find it enriching! The book is a treasure.

 

The reason I mention these sections is because Proximity, then Attendance are the foundation to reading the Petit Lenormand. As a beginner, I have been working on and prioritizing understanding and applying both. The remaining techniques (what Andy calls "Direction," "Correlation," and "Theme" in his book) are there to add details but they never trump the fundamental method of deriving meaning from the cards via proximity and order/attendance. (This makes sense when you look at the original instructions, from the 1800s, that came with cards, which you can find in "Appendix #7" in Andy's book.)

 

So looking at your combination the Scythe - the Mice, the Scythe comes first, with the Mice describing it. So you might have a separation that's messy, a sudden blow with debilitating effects. Context will matter, but I can't see this combination as being anything other than negative. Of course, one would also have to consider where the combination falls--at the beginning of the line, or at the end? near to, or far from the Significator and other key cards (e.g. the Clouds)--to determine how bad and for how long the negative impact of the combination will be.

 

Just my two cents! There are more experienced readers on the forum, and to echo what joy said above, you will find lots of helpful details here, with one caveat being I have found it incredibly helpful to stick with one primary resource while learning. Best of luck!

[joy]

Thank you @frankiefor this very interesting explanation! I too have Andy's book and I stick to that one. I do not even think anything else is needed really.

[frankie]

Sure thing @joy 😉 and yes, I feel the same way! ❤️

[Curiosity]

On 7/26/2022 at 6:30 PM, joy said:

Hey @Curiosity to be very honest this one is in my opinion a very difficult combination to read at least for me. Also it depends a lot on the context and the cards around. There are some more threads talking about those 2 cards, if you search using the search box you will find them. And hopefully get some useful answers.

  

Hi Joy! 😊

I followed your advice and actually found something. I'm gonna try linking it below, as I reply to Frankie as well.

About the cards around, some of them are also not great (like the fox and the clouds, for instance, but I'm not going to elaborate on this cause I don't want the thread to become about the GT in general, for that I should have posted it somewhere else). As I said, I made a commitment to myself to not freak out regarding the reading cause I can't really read it yet, but I feel like there might be some hard things coming my way.

 

11 hours ago, frankie said:

Hi Curiosity.  I'm learning Lenormand as well, but I thought I would share what I've gleaned from my experiences so far and from my understanding of Andy B.'s writings.

 

From what I've understood and seen in my readings, two negative cards amplify each other and do not cancel each other out. IMO, as others have written on this forum before, this also makes sense based on what we see in nature. Can a mouse eat away a scythe? No, but they can soil it.

 

 

Hi Frankie! Thank you for replying, and so thoroughly as well. 😊

 

Yeah, I remember reading about bad cards amplifying each other. It was because of what I read in Treppnner's course that I wondered if maybe scythe and mice together could be an exception. I have read most of Andy's book already, but it's a lot to take in, so I am sure I am gonna have to re-read it ate least a few of times. I am now trying to do the exercise with 2 nouns + 2 adjectives for each card. I'm still doing the tree, though. It's taking a while because my copy of the book (kindle) is in English, so while I am reading it I tend to think in English as well. Even though my English is not bad, sometimes it is hard to choose the keywords, specially the adjectives. So I have to "make myself" remember to do it in Portuguese. It's a bit confusing. Choosing "near" and "far" adjectives has been a bit challenging as well. 

 

I like what you said about what we see in nature. I would never have thought of it this way and it seems like it can be helpful. I guess I am focusing too much on keywords and forgetting to take other aspects into account. Also, I did a bit of searching here in the forum, and I found a post that gave me some more info on that. This one:  

 

 

I don't know if it is possible to quote another thread here, but I found the following in there: "Now, this is interesting: I have experienced the mice - serpent as the cancelling tendency, same with mice - scythe, that one becomes blunt (having the mice as gnawing to the left, sh**ing to the right, and we actually use a scythe to tend to parts of the lawn - no mouse will bite in that one, yet their feces can accelerate oxidation if around the blade)." I can't tell who wrote this since the user is identified as "Guest", but it makes sense. I my case the mice wouldn't have a mitigating effect on the scythe though, because they are to its right. 

 

One thing that is particularly hard for me when trying to see things in a more "literal" way (like in "real mice would never bite in a scythe") is that I never really know how far to take the "literal". I don't know that much about mice, but I don't think they would bite in a ring, and anchor, or a key as well, since these are metal. So you think this logic would still apply here? Does this make any sense? 😅 Also, they physically couldn't bite the sun, or the stars. I guess in this case it would make no sense to take this literally, since it wouldn't be possible anyway, right? 

 

11 hours ago, frankie said:

Since you mention that you have Andy's book (I cannot tell you how much I adore it) I'd suggest looking through the beginning of Part Two ("Combining and Reading the Cards Together"), especially the sections on Proximity and Attendance (p. 125-133). I do quite a lot of re-reading myself, and always find it enriching! The book is a treasure.

 

The reason I mention these sections is because Proximity, then Attendance are the foundation to reading the Petit Lenormand. As a beginner, I have been working on and prioritizing understanding and applying both. The remaining techniques (what Andy calls "Direction," "Correlation," and "Theme" in his book) are there to add details but they never trump the fundamental method of deriving meaning from the cards via proximity and order/attendance. (This makes sense when you look at the original instructions, from the 1800s, that came with cards, which you can find in "Appendix #7" in Andy's book.)

 

I think I'm gonna have to change the way I have been approaching this book. I have been reading and highlighting stuff, but there are so many details and possibilities, I end up forgetting or confusing things. For instance, one thing that has been hard for me is telling what is more important, and I didn't remember that nothing trumps proximity and order/attendance. Another thing that gets me is the lines in the GT. Andy has an order in which he reads the GT, the cut, the first 3 cards, the corners, etc, etc. So does this mean that we don't read the lines as lines, (creating a little story, as we would in a line of five, for instance) except when doing division? (after asking this, I just read part 2 as you suggested and he says attendance combinations are used for up to five cards, so I guess not).

 

Thank you for the suggestion! I just re-read it and noticed some things I had missed/forgotten. It helped make clear the difference between proximity and attendance, which I think I was mixing up. I think I'm gonna do like I did in school and use a notebook in which I can write a summary or something alike. Writing things down makes it easier for me to learn. 

 

11 hours ago, frankie said:

So looking at your combination the Scythe - the Mice, the Scythe comes first, with the Mice describing it. So you might have a separation that's messy, a sudden blow with debilitating effects. Context will matter, but I can't see this combination as being anything other than negative. Of course, one would also have to consider where the combination falls--at the beginning of the line, or at the end? near to, or far from the Significator and other key cards (e.g. the Clouds)--to determine how bad and for how long the negative impact of the combination will be.

 

Yeah, I think I get it now, at least a bit better. I'm not sure what this is about yet, though. The fox and the clouds are affecting them as well, so I suppose I better buckle up 😅 At least it is the clear side of the clouds so, hopefully, whatever it is won't last that very long. 

 

11 hours ago, frankie said:

Just my two cents! There are more experienced readers on the forum, and to echo what joy said above, you will find lots of helpful details here, with one caveat being I have found it incredibly helpful to stick with one primary resource while learning. Best of luck!

 

Thanks again, you helped a lot! I'm sorry for the lenghty reply. It's just that I don't really have anyone outside the forum to talk to about this. so I end up getting carried away here. 😁 And yeah, mutiple resources seem to be confusing me more than helping me. I am going to stick to Andy's book (with the ocasional help from our friends here in the forum) for now.

 

 

Edited July 28, 2022 by Curiosity
wrong emote

[joy]

Hey @Curiosity

Going to give my thoughts:

11 hours ago, Curiosity said:

  

Hi Joy! 😊

I followed your advice and actually found something. I'm gonna try linking it below, as I reply to Frankie as well.

About the cards around, some of them are also not great (like the fox and the clouds, for instance, but I'm not going to elaborate on this cause I don't want the thread to become about the GT in general, for that I should have posted it somewhere else). As I said, I made a commitment to myself to not freak out regarding the reading cause I can't really read it yet, but I feel like there might be some hard things coming my way.

 

Well if one does a GT all those not so nice cards will appear 😆 But maybe you can use them to your benefit? Like nothing is written in stone and if you know what could happen you can either change the outcome or at least be prepared!

 

11 hours ago, Curiosity said:

 

I don't know if it is possible to quote another thread here, but I found the following in there: "Now, this is interesting: I have experienced the mice - serpent as the cancelling tendency, same with mice - scythe, that one becomes blunt (having the mice as gnawing to the left, sh**ing to the right, and we actually use a scythe to tend to parts of the lawn - no mouse will bite in that one, yet their feces can accelerate oxidation if around the blade)." I can't tell who wrote this since the user is identified as "Guest", but it makes sense. I my case the mice wouldn't have a mitigating effect on the scythe though, because they are to its right. 

 

One thing that is particularly hard for me when trying to see things in a more "literal" way (like in "real mice would never bite in a scythe") is that I never really know how far to take the "literal". I don't know that much about mice, but I don't think they would bite in a ring, and anchor, or a key as well, since these are metal. So you think this logic would still apply here? Does this make any sense? 😅 Also, they physically couldn't bite the sun, or the stars. I guess in this case it would make no sense to take this literally, since it wouldn't be possible anyway, right? 

 

I think the literal part comes more into play for daily readings. But not so much in monthly or even GT's. Like it said in that post the Mice's feces has an impact on a lot of stuff even metal.
Right Mice - Sun would be more like your energy is lacking or you have to put in hard work before you get success. And that could be possible in a daily reading too.

 

11 hours ago, Curiosity said:

I think I'm gonna have to change the way I have been approaching this book. I have been reading and highlighting stuff, but there are so many details and possibilities, I end up forgetting or confusing things. For instance, one thing that has been hard for me is telling what is more important, and I didn't remember that nothing trumps proximity and order/attendance. Another thing that gets me is the lines in the GT. Andy has an order in which he reads the GT, the cut, the first 3 cards, the corners, etc, etc. So does this mean that we don't read the lines as lines, (creating a little story, as we would in a line of five, for instance) except when doing division? (after asking this, I just read part 2 as you suggested and he says attendance combinations are used for up to five cards, so I guess not).

 

Right a GT is different. So if you want to see how work is going then look first where to find the anchor and see where you are. And the fish for finances and the heart for love. As far as I can see not the whole GT has to be read, that would give too much information.Plus the corners give the situation.

 

11 hours ago, Curiosity said:

Thank you for the suggestion! I just re-read it and noticed some things I had missed/forgotten. It helped make clear the difference between proximity and attendance, which I think I was mixing up. I think I'm gonna do like I did in school and use a notebook in which I can write a summary or something alike. Writing things down makes it easier for me to learn. 

 

Same here, I need to write stuff down in my own words. That helps me much better to remember. Typing on a computer is not the same.... Strange but true.

 

11 hours ago, Curiosity said:

Yeah, I think I get it now, at least a bit better. I'm not sure what this is about yet, though. The fox and the clouds are affecting them as well, so I suppose I better buckle up 😅 At least it is the clear side of the clouds so, hopefully, whatever it is won't last that very long. 

 

It will pass! And as I said if you would not have laid the cards you would not know and you would not be prepared. And who knows maybe you can 'change' it!

 

11 hours ago, Curiosity said:

Thanks again, you helped a lot! I'm sorry for the lenghty reply. It's just that I don't really have anyone outside the forum to talk to about this. so I end up getting carried away here. 😁 And yeah, mutiple resources seem to be confusing me more than helping me. I am going to stick to Andy's book (with the ocasional help from our friends here in the forum) for now.

 

For me length is not a problem at all! I love to exchange and question my own thinking and answers. That is the best way to learn!

 

Oh by the way, do you not feel like participating in our monthly exchanges? That is good training too 🙂

 

All the best! ❤️

[frankie]

11 hours ago, Curiosity said:

I have read most of Andy's book already, but it's a lot to take in, so I am sure I am gonna have to re-read it ate least a few of times.

There's no harm in that! I'm constantly re-reading it and discovering things I hadn't noticed before.

 

11 hours ago, Curiosity said:

I am now trying to do the exercise with 2 nouns + 2 adjectives for each card.

Yes, I found the exercise helpful when I started out, but don't let it stop you from handling and practicing with the cards themselves. A simple line of three cards to answer a specific question will help you get familiar with how the cards speak.

 

12 hours ago, Curiosity said:

like what you said about what we see in nature. I would never have thought of it this way and it seems like it can be helpful. I guess I am focusing too much on keywords and forgetting to take other aspects into account. Also, I did a bit of searching here in the forum, and I found a post that gave me some more info on that.

I'm parroting what others have said here and what Andy has written about as well, which makes a lot of sense to me and helps me understand how the cards function. I remember that thread--thank you for linking it. One thing that strikes me, which I hadn't noticed before is this line: "Often polarity is confused with benefic/malefic but the reality is positive v. negative is more to do with facilitation. The Coffin will decompose, the Scythe sever and the Cross will extinguish. It’s often the context that determines how beneficial." Will be thinking this over now because I believe I've been confusing these concepts!

 

12 hours ago, Curiosity said:

One thing that is particularly hard for me when trying to see things in a more "literal" way (like in "real mice would never bite in a scythe") is that I never really know how far to take the "literal". I don't know that much about mice, but I don't think they would bite in a ring, and anchor, or a key as well, since these are metal. So you think this logic would still apply here? Does this make any sense? 😅 Also, they physically couldn't bite the sun, or the stars. I guess in this case it would make no sense to take this literally, since it wouldn't be possible anyway, right?

I'm not experienced enough to explain this adequately, but I'll try my best. I would think of each card in terms of how the emblem pictured functions in real life, like what it does. For example, see the line I quoted above: "the Coffin will decompose, the Scythe sever, etc." We've been talking about negative cards cancelling each other out, so in the Scythe - the Mice combination, I don't see how gnawing (the Mice) would stop a sudden cut from a very large, very sharp tool (the Scythe).

 

Sure, the Mice can't bite the Sun, but by the rays of the Sun, you might see what you're lacking, which would minimize something that is otherwise a success (the Sun + the Mice), or that the source of your betterment is deficient. Again, the card order matters, and the Mice "bites" the card to its left, which is card A in an A-B combination. The Anchor grounds and stabilizes, but with the Mice, you'd be stuck to something that's deteriorating, diminishing (the Anchor + the Mice). The Ring binds, perpetuates, obligates so you could have duty or relationship that taxes or wears you down (the Ring + the Mice).

 

I did want to add something that I thought about later, after I posted yesterday. There are card pairings that will neutralize malefic cards, and again, these make sense by how the emblems function in real-life. So the Serpent will neutralize the Mice, the Stork will neutralize the Serpent since each animal eats the other in nature. Interestingly, according to the original instructions, the danger of the Scythe "can be avoided when surrounded by good cards" (p. 278 in Andy's book).

 

12 hours ago, Curiosity said:

one thing that has been hard for me is telling what is more important

Yes, I can understand that. Given constraints on my time, I would say what has helped me is sticking to small spreads (e.g. lines of three, tirage en croix) to get the basics down, like truly understanding how an A - B pairing is different from a B - A pairing, and consistently writing out my interpretations. For me, having concrete readings as examples helps clarify what's written in the book. The practical experience solidifies the explanations, in other words. 

 

Unfortunately, I'm no help when it comes to the grand tableau. I've been practicing, but I'm years away from being able to offer any real advice other than stick with the process Andy lays out and keep trying. Sometimes I just look at where the Significator and the Clouds are, and which cards surround each to get a feel of things. I've also made my own list of the card meanings based on proximity--Andy includes these meanings for each card--and it's helpful to see the meanings all together. Basically, it's a modified version of the original instructions 😆 but, like you, the process of writing it all has helped me understand things better.

 

13 hours ago, Curiosity said:

So does this mean that we don't read the lines as lines, (creating a little story, as we would in a line of five, for instance) except when doing division?

Others with more experience would know, but if I go by what I've understood based on what I've read, I believe the answer is yes, only with division, because division is a technique Andy recommends for a tableau that covers one month (see p. 157-8). This is different from his approach for a traditional tableau (p. 180-1). I have yet to try a past, present, future tableau so I can't speak to what he outlines there.

 

13 hours ago, Curiosity said:

Thanks again, you helped a lot! I'm sorry for the lenghty reply. It's just that I don't really have anyone outside the forum to talk to about this. so I end up getting carried away here. 😁 And yeah, mutiple resources seem to be confusing me more than helping me. I am going to stick to Andy's book (with the ocasional help from our friends here in the forum) for now.

No problem. I'm really only repeating (and probably badly) lessons that have stuck with me, and no need to apologize for the lengthy reply. I've just written a lot, too. 😉 My studies are pretty solitary as well and I haven't had as much time to visit the forum, although with my daily handling of the cards, I feel like the Petit Lenormand has become a constant companion, sometimes frustrating but always rewarding. I wish the same for you as well! 😊

[joy]

And again thank you @frankie your answer cleared up a lot for me!

[Curiosity]

On 7/28/2022 at 1:27 PM, joy said:

Well if one does a GT all those not so nice cards will appear  But maybe you can use them to your benefit? Like nothing is written in stone and if you know what could happen you can either change the outcome or at least be prepared!

 

Hello again, joy 🙂 

 

Yeah, I've been trying to think of it this way. I mean, even though I am not sure what it refers to, at least I might be able to see it coming and maybe do something about it. 

 

On 7/28/2022 at 1:27 PM, joy said:

I think the literal part comes more into play for daily readings. But not so much in monthly or even GT's. Like it said in that post the Mice's feces has an impact on a lot of stuff even metal.
Right Mice - Sun would be more like your energy is lacking or you have to put in hard work before you get success. And that could be possible in a daily reading too.

 

That's a much less dramatic interpretation than I would have given. I think this might be one of the problems, I'm still a bit stuck to the worst meanings of the negative cards and having trouble to expand/adapt them. Then I look at the GT and have the feeling that the bad cards are spoiling most of it 😂. That's part of the reason why I can't take myself reading it too seriously yet. 

 

By "Right Mice - Sun" you mean first the Sun and then the mice? 

 

On 7/28/2022 at 1:27 PM, joy said:

Right a GT is different. So if you want to see how work is going then look first where to find the anchor and see where you are. And the fish for finances and the heart for love. As far as I can see not the whole GT has to be read, that would give too much information.Plus the corners give the situation.

 

Thanks! 

 

About these cards, it is not like they are "fixed", is it?  For instance, I'm in a new job. The anchor is about security and stability, right? Would this still be a "work" card in the case of something one's just started? I'm a teacher now, so can this mean that I can look for the book the see about this job?

 

On 7/28/2022 at 1:27 PM, joy said:

Same here, I need to write stuff down in my own words. That helps me much better to remember. Typing on a computer is not the same.... Strange but true.

 

 

I've actually read something about this once, but I don't remember it well.  I think there are actual studies suggesting that writing stuff down with pen and paper is better for learning, or at least memorizing, than typing is. And TBH I just love handwritting, so it makes me happier to do it 😁

 

On 7/28/2022 at 1:27 PM, joy said:

For me length is not a problem at all! I love to exchange and question my own thinking and answers. That is the best way to learn!

 

Oh by the way, do you not feel like participating in our monthly exchanges? That is good training too 🙂

 

All the best! ❤️

 

I agree with you here. I like reading the books, of course, but I feel like I learn much more with this kind of exchange. 

 

I like your suggestion! Are the monthly exchanges suitable for total beginners?  I'll check that!

Thanks, joy! 🙂 

[Curiosity]

On 7/28/2022 at 4:19 PM, frankie said:

There's no harm in that! I'm constantly re-reading it and discovering things I hadn't noticed before.

 

Yes, I found the exercise helpful when I started out, but don't let it stop you from handling and practicing with the cards themselves. A simple line of three cards to answer a specific question will help you get familiar with how the cards speak.

 

I'm parroting what others have said here and what Andy has written about as well, which makes a lot of sense to me and helps me understand how the cards function. I remember that thread--thank you for linking it. One thing that strikes me, which I hadn't noticed before is this line: "Often polarity is confused with benefic/malefic but the reality is positive v. negative is more to do with facilitation. The Coffin will decompose, the Scythe sever and the Cross will extinguish. It’s often the context that determines how beneficial." Will be thinking this over now because I believe I've been confusing these concepts!

 

I'm not experienced enough to explain this adequately, but I'll try my best. I would think of each card in terms of how the emblem pictured functions in real life, like what it does. For example, see the line I quoted above: "the Coffin will decompose, the Scythe sever, etc." We've been talking about negative cards cancelling each other out, so in the Scythe - the Mice combination, I don't see how gnawing (the Mice) would stop a sudden cut from a very large, very sharp tool (the Scythe).

 

Sure, the Mice can't bite the Sun, but by the rays of the Sun, you might see what you're lacking, which would minimize something that is otherwise a success (the Sun + the Mice), or that the source of your betterment is deficient. Again, the card order matters, and the Mice "bites" the card to its left, which is card A in an A-B combination. The Anchor grounds and stabilizes, but with the Mice, you'd be stuck to something that's deteriorating, diminishing (the Anchor + the Mice). The Ring binds, perpetuates, obligates so you could have duty or relationship that taxes or wears you down (the Ring + the Mice).

 

I did want to add something that I thought about later, after I posted yesterday. There are card pairings that will neutralize malefic cards, and again, these make sense by how the emblems function in real-life. So the Serpent will neutralize the Mice, the Stork will neutralize the Serpent since each animal eats the other in nature. Interestingly, according to the original instructions, the danger of the Scythe "can be avoided when surrounded by good cards" (p. 278 in Andy's book).

 

Yes, I can understand that. Given constraints on my time, I would say what has helped me is sticking to small spreads (e.g. lines of three, tirage en croix) to get the basics down, like truly understanding how an A - B pairing is different from a B - A pairing, and consistently writing out my interpretations. For me, having concrete readings as examples helps clarify what's written in the book. The practical experience solidifies the explanations, in other words. 

 

Unfortunately, I'm no help when it comes to the grand tableau. I've been practicing, but I'm years away from being able to offer any real advice other than stick with the process Andy lays out and keep trying. Sometimes I just look at where the Significator and the Clouds are, and which cards surround each to get a feel of things. I've also made my own list of the card meanings based on proximity--Andy includes these meanings for each card--and it's helpful to see the meanings all together. Basically, it's a modified version of the original instructions 😆 but, like you, the process of writing it all has helped me understand things better.

 

Others with more experience would know, but if I go by what I've understood based on what I've read, I believe the answer is yes, only with division, because division is a technique Andy recommends for a tableau that covers one month (see p. 157-8). This is different from his approach for a traditional tableau (p. 180-1). I have yet to try a past, present, future tableau so I can't speak to what he outlines there.

 

No problem. I'm really only repeating (and probably badly) lessons that have stuck with me, and no need to apologize for the lengthy reply. I've just written a lot, too. 😉 My studies are pretty solitary as well and I haven't had as much time to visit the forum, although with my daily handling of the cards, I feel like the Petit Lenormand has become a constant companion, sometimes frustrating but always rewarding. I wish the same for you as well! 😊

 

I ran out of time now, (late for an appointment) but just wanna say a quick thanks so you don't think I just ignored this.  I'm gonna give it a better read and reply again later! 

Edited July 31, 2022 by Curiosity

[joy]

23 hours ago, Curiosity said:

That's a much less dramatic interpretation than I would have given. I think this might be one of the problems, I'm still a bit stuck to the worst meanings of the negative cards and having trouble to expand/adapt them. Then I look at the GT and have the feeling that the bad cards are spoiling most of it 😂. That's part of the reason why I can't take myself reading it too seriously yet. 

 

By "Right Mice - Sun" you mean first the Sun and then the mice? 

 

No I meant Mice - Sun

Mice = Theft, loss, anxiety
Sun = Success, good fortune, optimism

 

Mice - Sun = Anxious about success

Sun - Mice = Anxious success

 

It is a slight difference. In my opinion that is the hard part about reading Lenormand. Still learning. But I think one good exercise would be to just do that. See how 2 pairs read if the order is changed.

 

 

23 hours ago, Curiosity said:

About these cards, it is not like they are "fixed", is it?  For instance, I'm in a new job. The anchor is about security and stability, right? Would this still be a "work" card in the case of something one's just started? I'm a teacher now, so can this mean that I can look for the book the see about this job?

 

With Lenormand they are fixed. What ever you assign as your work card will always be your work card. Some people assign the Fox as their card for work. For me it is the Anchor. But in Andy B's book it says:
Anchor = Work stability

Ship = for Retail / Trade
Moon = if you hunt for a job

 

In your case I think I would see where the Anchor is in the GT.

 

23 hours ago, Curiosity said:

 

I've actually read something about this once, but I don't remember it well.  I think there are actual studies suggesting that writing stuff down with pen and paper is better for learning, or at least memorizing, than typing is. And TBH I just love handwritting, so it makes me happier to do it 😁

 

Yes I think I read that too. The movement of the hand somehow connects with the brain and therefore stores it better. Well that is how it works with me. I do love handwriting too!

 

23 hours ago, Curiosity said:

I agree with you here. I like reading the books, of course, but I feel like I learn much more with this kind of exchange. 

 

Agreed the more opinion and insights we get it helps at least it does help me!

 

23 hours ago, Curiosity said:

 

I like your suggestion! Are the monthly exchanges suitable for total beginners?  I'll check that!

 

Absolutely! They are for everybody! Hope to see you, we just opened it up for August:

 

23 hours ago, Curiosity said:

Thanks, joy! 🙂 

 

Thank you! Learned something new too! 🙂

[frankie]

On 7/28/2022 at 6:50 PM, joy said:

And again thank you @frankie your answer cleared up a lot for me!

That's very kind of you to say, and no problem at all ❤️ I still have so much more to learn!

 

On 7/31/2022 at 10:32 AM, Curiosity said:

 

I ran out of time now, (late for an appointment) but just wanna say a quick thanks so you don't think I just ignored this.  I'm gonna give it a better read and reply again later! 

You're welcome and no rush/worries about replying. In fact, if I go radio silent, please know life is getting in my way too. It happens! 😉