Raggydoll Posted August 10, 2020 Posted August 10, 2020 This topic is a continuation of something that came up in the de-enable thread. We started talking about how so many of us seem to have one or more decks in our collection (or that used to be in our collection) that we simply can't get good readings from. I am talking about the decks that we find to be the opposite of 'work horses' and 'talkers'. It is the decks that seem to be very unwilling to cooperate or to spill the beans. So I thought it would be fun to ask even more people if they have had this experience. If you have, were you able to get past it? (If so, how?). Have you decided to keep or to re-home those silent decks, and why? Although this is not about any decks in specific, it might still be fun and interesting to hear about what decks you found to be silent. Maybe certain decks are more prone to silence or maybe it is entirely individual? Any theories or thoughts that you have are much welcome 😀 Okay, so if I were to start and try to name a deck that has been a silent one for me...hmm.. I would say that the Pagan Otherworlds would likely be one of them. I found that deck to be so beautiful. It just wasn't giving me very juicy readings. I decided to re-home it to someone who now gets tons of pleasure out of it.
Decan Posted August 10, 2020 Posted August 10, 2020 4 minutes ago, Raggydoll said: I would say that the Pagan Otherworlds would likely be one of them. I found that deck to be so beautiful. It just wasn't giving me very juicy readings. I decided to re-home it to someone who now gets tons of pleasure out of it. The same for me, and I thought about it while I was reading the first part of your post. I didn't re-home it but it's something I planned. Actually I find it beautiful but "cold", a curious mix, but it is "a silent deck". The Tinker's Damn Tarot is also a silent deck for me; actually it's likely because several cards make me uncomfortable.
katrinka Posted August 10, 2020 Posted August 10, 2020 The Holy Light isn't totally silent, but I never got to know it well enough to really get it to speak. It's one of those decks that makes me look things up. Beautiful, but it requires a huge investment of time and study that I just haven't been able to sustain. Hopefully one of these days...
Niobium Posted August 10, 2020 Posted August 10, 2020 I have to say that, unfortunately, the Mary-El Tarot is like this for me, as is Tarot of the Silicon Dawn. I've found a new home for TotSD, not sure what to do about Mary-El. It's absolutely lovely, but the imagery really doesn't //say// things in a language I can understand. A real shame, I do like to look at it.
gregory Posted August 10, 2020 Posted August 10, 2020 Oh lord, yes - Holy Light. It makes me feel Inferior. I can read with Mary El, but I hate to, as it feels like reading with someone else's private diary, if that makes sense. Creepy..
katrinka Posted August 10, 2020 Posted August 10, 2020 (edited) Now that you mention it, reading with the Mary El does feel kind of like peeping into someone's personal stuff. It's a great deck, though. Edited August 10, 2020 by katrinka
Raggydoll Posted August 10, 2020 Author Posted August 10, 2020 2 hours ago, katrinka said: The Holy Light isn't totally silent, but I never got to know it well enough to really get it to speak. It's one of those decks that makes me look things up. Beautiful, but it requires a huge investment of time and study that I just haven't been able to sustain. Hopefully one of these days... Yes I know those type of decks. I rarely add any of those to my collection anymore. I prefer when I can start reading straight away with a deck. I have one deck that I am ambivalent about. I find it somewhat difficult but not precisely silent. But it is one I hesitate to take out - Animal Spirit deck (Kim Krans). I think it is because the meanings don't come intuitively for me and that I don't 100% connect with the associations in the guidebook. So in a way, the images are not talking loudly to me. I would classify that deck as one that is a bit more work than I prefer. Back in the days I would have likely studied it and gotten to know it intimately but these days I am not really like that. Too busy with other things!
Raggydoll Posted August 10, 2020 Author Posted August 10, 2020 2 hours ago, Niobium said: I have to say that, unfortunately, the Mary-El Tarot is like this for me, as is Tarot of the Silicon Dawn. I've found a new home for TotSD, not sure what to do about Mary-El. It's absolutely lovely, but the imagery really doesn't //say// things in a language I can understand. A real shame, I do like to look at it. The Mary-El is one I have decided to not add to my collection, for multiple reasons. I do not think it would be a reader for me. It is not necessarily that I think I would find it silent, but I highly suspect we don't talk the same language, if that makes sense!
Raggydoll Posted August 10, 2020 Author Posted August 10, 2020 1 hour ago, gregory said: Oh lord, yes - Holy Light. It makes me feel Inferior. Now that its been mentioned twice in this thread I had to look this deck up. I don't think it would be a match for me either. 1 hour ago, gregory said: I can read with Mary El, but I hate to, as it feels like reading with someone else's private diary, if that makes sense. Creepy.. It makes total sense.
Decan Posted August 10, 2020 Posted August 10, 2020 (edited) I don't have the Holy Light Tarot, so I looked at it online. The colors make it attractive while a bit over-ornated. But it seems based on the Kabbalah, and this is a complex topic, actually I never really studied this system. I add the Alchemical Tarot (by Robert Place) among the silent (or semi-silent) decks (I resold it a few years ago); difficult to get into it if that makes sense. Edited August 10, 2020 by Decan
Flaxen Posted August 10, 2020 Posted August 10, 2020 I concur with some of the decks already mentioned. The ones which stay most silent for me are those which have a different language which I haven’t yet learnt. There is a worldview embedded in them which doesn’t quite resonate with me and so it feels like we are at cross-purposes. Mary-el is one although I find the art beautiful. Manga style decks, Robert Place’s Vampire tarot and the Gill are all silent for me.
HermitWriter Posted August 10, 2020 Posted August 10, 2020 For me, it's any of the Visconti-Sforza decks. I love history, I enjoy art from that period, playing cards is a long-standing pastime in my family, so it should be a no-brainer, right? But nope, for some reason we just don't mesh. I have two, ostensibly for research purposes, but if I'm honest, I rarely even use them for that.
Rupicapra Posted August 10, 2020 Posted August 10, 2020 I have to say it: The Wild Unknown. I love Kim Krans' art, I really do, I got one of her books and her other decks, too. But: I look at the cards and think: Oh, what lovely pictures, and they tell me.... .... .... that there is a pretty butterfly. I've not given up on it yet, I'm holding on to, even if it is just to look at the images!
Raggydoll Posted August 10, 2020 Author Posted August 10, 2020 1 hour ago, Rupicapra said: I have to say it: The Wild Unknown. I love Kim Krans' art, I really do, I got one of her books and her other decks, too. But: I look at the cards and think: Oh, what lovely pictures, and they tell me.... .... .... that there is a pretty butterfly. I've not given up on it yet, I'm holding on to, even if it is just to look at the images! I would say that some of the images in that deck talk to me and others are silent. So I don’t use it very often.
katrinka Posted August 10, 2020 Posted August 10, 2020 4 hours ago, Raggydoll said: Now that its been mentioned twice in this thread I had to look this deck up. I don't think it would be a match for me either. It makes total sense. And the thing is, I really like a lot of the images. (OK, some of the people in it are fugly, but it's that weird antique alchemy fugliness, so I can deal with it.) And it's linen. I really wanted it to be a workhorse deck, but not badly enough to sacrifice sleep learning a complex system just for one deck. I'd need a lot more free time. I'd need to be retired. 4 hours ago, Decan said: I don't have the Holy Light Tarot, so I looked at it online. The colors make it attractive while a bit over-ornated. But it seems based on the Kabbalah, and this is a complex topic, actually I never really studied this system. I may be misremembering this, but if I'm not mistaken, it's a departure from the Qabalistic correspondences in the Thoth. So that would be two deep and complex system to remember. Three, if you study authentic Jewish Kabbalah. I think that if I ever seriously apply myself to the Holy Light, I'll concentrate on the alchemical symbols and leave the other stuff out. 4 hours ago, Decan said: I add the Alchemical Tarot (by Robert Place) among the silent (or semi-silent) decks (I resold it a few years ago); difficult to get into it if that makes sense. 4 hours ago, Flaxen said: I concur with some of the decks already mentioned. The ones which stay most silent for me are those which have a different language which I haven’t yet learnt. There is a worldview embedded in them which doesn’t quite resonate with me and so it feels like we are at cross-purposes. Mary-el is one although I find the art beautiful. Manga style decks, Robert Place’s Vampire tarot and the Gill are all silent for me. I wouldn't want to use a Manga deck, either. TBH, Manga was novel and interesting was novel back when I was watching Sailor Moon and Pokemon with the kids, but it's been done to death since then. Place is getting some mentions here. Is it the sterility of the art? I only have one of his, the Buddha Tarot. I still think Buddhist thought and Tarot are a potentially wonderful combination, but I'd like to see one that isn't just grafting Buddhism 101 to a Tarot structure. And couldn't he make people in India less caucasian-looking? 2 hours ago, Rupicapra said: I have to say it: The Wild Unknown. I love Kim Krans' art, I really do, I got one of her books and her other decks, too. But: I look at the cards and think: Oh, what lovely pictures, and they tell me.... .... .... that there is a pretty butterfly. I've not given up on it yet, I'm holding on to, even if it is just to look at the images! That was a major bandwagon deck. I could never get on board, for the reasons you state. The Empress is a tree, OK, trees can be fertile and nurturing, in their own way. And the Emperor is another tree. so again, OK, a tree's mate would also be a tree, but these are two different kinds of trees. The Emperor tree can't pollinate the Empress tree, can it?
Guest Posted August 10, 2020 Posted August 10, 2020 I agree with a lot of these too -- Tarot of the Holy Light, Visconti-Sforza, Mary-El -- all gorgeous but hard to read. For me I would add Tierra del Fuego and Daniloff to the mix, plus the Grand Etteilla and the Balbi but they're all oh-so-fun to look at! The Oriens and the Marigold fall flat for me too, but maybe some day... I've seen the Mary-El trimmed and turned into an oracle deck - it looked promising.
Niobium Posted August 11, 2020 Posted August 11, 2020 3 hours ago, barkingdeer said: I agree with a lot of these too -- Tarot of the Holy Light, Visconti-Sforza, Mary-El -- all gorgeous but hard to read. For me I would add Tierra del Fuego and Daniloff to the mix, plus the Grand Etteilla and the Balbi but they're all oh-so-fun to look at! The Oriens and the Marigold fall flat for me too, but maybe some day... I've seen the Mary-El trimmed and turned into an oracle deck - it looked promising. I've found my Daniloff, which is a...Fourth Ed? to be a little opaque, so I can understand how it might be a hard read. The art works for me but it's by no means an easy read. ...okay...I hadn't even THOUGHT of that. I could just ignore the Arcana markings... Thank you, this is a solid idea. I could easily read a lot of interesting meanings into the images, just not necessarily what those minors/majors would mean. Well now I have a project: make an association booklet for myself.
Flaxen Posted August 11, 2020 Posted August 11, 2020 On 8/10/2020 at 3:13 PM, katrinka said: Place is getting some mentions here. Is it the sterility of the art? Yes, it could be that. I also have his Alchemical Tarot: Renewed and Tarot of the Sevenfold Mystery. Don’t use them that much either even though I like the philosophy behind them.
katrinka Posted August 11, 2020 Posted August 11, 2020 38 minutes ago, Flaxen said: Yes, it could be that. I also have his Alchemical Tarot: Renewed and Tarot of the Sevenfold Mystery. Don’t use them that much either even though I like the philosophy behind them. I don't think he delves very deeply into the philosophies behind his decks. I actually had the companion book to the Buddha at one time, and as I recall, it consisted mostly of Tarot and Tarot history. It was a Tarotization of Buddhism, kind of like stuffing it into Tarot "boxes", rather than a meeting of two philosophies on equal ground, with discussion of the similarities and differences. It felt like a missed opportunity, and more than a little disrespectful. I get the feeling that he just picks a theme and does some minimal research. Alchemy is similarly complex, I still can't say I fully understand it. It would require a much bigger investment of time and study than Place seems willing to give. The subject deserves much more than things like simply coloring the Strength lion green. The guy didn't even research Lenormand properly, how is he going to take on deeper things like whole philosophies and religions?
gregory Posted August 11, 2020 Posted August 11, 2020 What I mind MOST about Place's decks is that the art feels sterile. Kind of like trying to read bathroom tiles.
katrinka Posted August 11, 2020 Posted August 11, 2020 1 hour ago, gregory said: What I mind MOST about Place's decks is that the art feels sterile. Kind of like trying to read bathroom tiles. I actually try to do that. The bathroom tiles at my job are some kind of fake marble, and there are pictures like a chicken with a cat's face, and a rat walking upright wearing wizard's robes, with a Gibson Les Paul growing out his head. I don't know what any of it means, but it's certainly less sterile than Place dacks. So I assume you're talking about plain tiles!
ilweran Posted August 12, 2020 Posted August 12, 2020 On 8/10/2020 at 3:13 PM, katrinka said: Place is getting some mentions here. Is it the sterility of the art? Could be. I always liked his art - though I take your point about the Buddha Tarot - but his decks don't speak to me. They just look nice, which is why I got rid of some of them and never bought his Vampire deck.
Marirowana Posted August 12, 2020 Posted August 12, 2020 My Deck of Silence was the Dali tarot. It was my first non-RWS deck, and I got it as a gift from my aunt, because I always had a love for Dali's art. But when I got it, I remember being so disappointed! The art didn't feel like the Dali I knew, and it didn't say a word in readings. The whole deck felt inconsistent, and I couldn't get over the bright yellow and red pentacles. I sold it and bought the Anna K. instead, that worked much better for me! (I told my aunt that her gift somehow transformed into something I actually wanted 😉 ). On 8/10/2020 at 12:15 PM, Rupicapra said: I have to say it: The Wild Unknown. I love Kim Krans' art, I really do, I got one of her books and her other decks, too. But: I look at the cards and think: Oh, what lovely pictures, and they tell me.... .... .... that there is a pretty butterfly. I've not given up on it yet, I'm holding on to, even if it is just to look at the images! On 8/10/2020 at 4:13 PM, katrinka said: That was a major bandwagon deck. I could never get on board, for the reasons you state. The Empress is a tree, OK, trees can be fertile and nurturing, in their own way. And the Emperor is another tree. so again, OK, a tree's mate would also be a tree, but these are two different kinds of trees. The Emperor tree can't pollinate the Empress tree, can it? The Wild Unknown is my go-to deck, and is my most chatty one as well! I get so much out of it, for both my personal readings and readings for others. I think what really helped me love it and learn to hear it's language, is the study thread at Aeclectic Tarot. The insights people there have shared, gave me more to hold on to. I then mix it with my own knowledge and experience of nature. Good examples are indeed the Empress and the Emperor. I hope that thread might help you use the deck and the pretty butterfly more, @Rupicapra ! (One might argue that the cards don't give much out of themselves, and that you need to project a lot of your own thoughts and associations on it before you can read in-depth with it. But I like it that way) Image of Dali Tarot:
Rupicapra Posted August 12, 2020 Posted August 12, 2020 8 hours ago, Marirowana said: study thread at Aeclectic Tarot Thank you @Marirowana, I will check it out!
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