How Tarot Cards Work

[AlbaTross]

As someone who leans heavily towards the secular end of things, this isn't news to me.  However, it was still a good read.  On a side note, I'm kind of curious which deck that is in the image under Tarot Card Philosophy.  

[katrinka]

No idea what deck it is, I can't recall ever seeing it before. That would be a question for @gregory, I think. 😉

I lean secular, too, but I thought the article was horribly ill-informed. These bits in particular:

"Asking how you could encourage your mother-in-law to move out, as opposed to asking how you can get along better with her, is narrowing the scope of the true question by answering it before you even get started."
 

At this point they're probably not interested in "getting along better." They want that woman OUT, and they want to know how to accomplish this. That IS the "true question", period. 

 

"But do not go so far as to ask how you can coordinate baseball, soccer and Cub Scout schedules and still have family time - that's too detailed."

 

It's obviously too detailed for Joan Bunning, but a competent reader could do it. I'd suggest several small spreads.

"Focus on yourself...For example, asking why your teenager is experimenting with drugs is focusing on them, not you. Asking what role you play in your teen's decision to experiment with drugs brings the question back to you."

That sounds totally useless. Especially if the parent plays no role whatsoever in that decision. Kids have minds of their own. 

 

The article goes on to post a now-dead link (these organizations are fly-by-night) to a place that sells Tarot certifications. 
Here is something I posted at my blog in 2013:
 

It doesn’t take much googling to find tons of scandals and pyramid schemes attached to the Tarot certification racket.:
Certified Apprentice Tarot Reader Examination (CATR)© 50.00
Certified Tarot Reader Examination (CTR)© 50.00
Certified Professional Tarot Reader Examination (CPTR)© 50.00
Certified Tarot Consultant Examination (CTC)© 75.00
Certified Tarot Master Examination (CTM)© 75.00
Certified Tarot Instructor Examination (CTI)© 75.00
Certified Tarot GrandMaster Examination (CTGM)©100.00
At one point, you have to verify that you’ve qualified students for at least 25 certification ranks. Which is a minimum of $50 per rank.

 

Beyond that there was the usual parroting of Jung, who never explains how synchronicity works - I don't think he knew. 
Yes, synchronicity exists, but that doesn't answer the question. And we don't know that it's on tap every time we pull cards, either. It doesn't happen 24/7 in other areas of life, so I suspect cards are no different. 

The article was a roundabout - and dishonest! - way of saying what a lot of us have been saying here: nobody knows.

 

[AlbaTross]

1 hour ago, katrinka said:

No idea what deck it is, I can't recall ever seeing it before. That would be a question for @gregory, I think. 😉

I lean secular, too, but I thought the article was horribly ill-informed. These bits in particular:

"Asking how you could encourage your mother-in-law to move out, as opposed to asking how you can get along better with her, is narrowing the scope of the true question by answering it before you even get started."
 

At this point they're probably not interested in "getting along better." They want that woman OUT, and they want to know how to accomplish this. That IS the "true question", period. 

 

"But do not go so far as to ask how you can coordinate baseball, soccer and Cub Scout schedules and still have family time - that's too detailed."

 

It's obviously too detailed for Joan Bunning, but a competent reader could do it. I'd suggest several small spreads.

"Focus on yourself...For example, asking why your teenager is experimenting with drugs is focusing on them, not you. Asking what role you play in your teen's decision to experiment with drugs brings the question back to you."

That sounds totally useless. Especially if the parent plays no role whatsoever in that decision. Kids have minds of their own. 

 

The article goes on to post a now-dead link (these organizations are fly-by-night) to a place that sells Tarot certifications. 
Here is something I posted at my blog in 2013:
 

It doesn’t take much googling to find tons of scandals and pyramid schemes attached to the Tarot certification racket.:
Certified Apprentice Tarot Reader Examination (CATR)© 50.00
Certified Tarot Reader Examination (CTR)© 50.00
Certified Professional Tarot Reader Examination (CPTR)© 50.00
Certified Tarot Consultant Examination (CTC)© 75.00
Certified Tarot Master Examination (CTM)© 75.00
Certified Tarot Instructor Examination (CTI)© 75.00
Certified Tarot GrandMaster Examination (CTGM)©100.00
At one point, you have to verify that you’ve qualified students for at least 25 certification ranks. Which is a minimum of $50 per rank.

 

Beyond that there was the usual parroting of Jung, who never explains how synchronicity works - I don't think he knew. 
Yes, synchronicity exists, but that doesn't answer the question. And we don't know that it's on tap every time we pull cards, either. It doesn't happen 24/7 in other areas of life, so I suspect cards are no different. 

The article was a roundabout - and dishonest! - way of saying what a lot of us have been saying here: nobody knows.

 

You clearly have a lot more experience with the Tarot in general, so thanks for your in-depth response.  It's always good to see different views on something instead of just accepting everything I read at face value.  I can't say I've developed strong enough feelings about this yet, but I'm definitely open to hearing about the different schools of thought.  I don't think I lean heavily into the Jungian type stuff, but I am intrigued by it nonetheless.  

 

I suppose I'll have to ask gregory about that deck then.  I don't think I need another RWS clone deck, but I am intrigued by the art of that one.  

Edited January 16, 2021 by AlbaTross

[gregory]

Gregory vaguely recognises it but will have to look later !

 

But all that certification stuff is bollocks.

[gregory]

Wait - it's the Cosmic, surely ?

 

http://www.aeclectic.net/tarot/cards/cosmic/

[katrinka]

10 hours ago, AlbaTross said:

On a side note, I'm kind of curious which deck that is in the image under Tarot Card Philosophy.  

 

This one, gregs.

[gregory]

@katrinka @AlbaTross

OH. (It wasn't at all clear which was meant. Sorry !)

 

That's the Royal Tarot - available in all sorts of places under all sorts of names. There are loads on ebay under the name Royal Tarot..

 

http://www.aeclectic.net/tarot/cards/royal/

Edited January 16, 2021 by gregory

[AlbaTross]

8 hours ago, katrinka said:

 

This one, gregs.

Oh, thanks for posting the image.  Yes, that's the one.

[AlbaTross]

3 hours ago, gregory said:

@katrinka @AlbaTross

OH. (It wasn't at all clear which was meant. Sorry !)

 

That's the Royal Tarot - available in all sorts of places under all sorts of names. There are loads on ebay under the name Royal Tarot..

 

http://www.aeclectic.net/tarot/cards/royal/

Thanks!  I'll have to take a look at this one.  

[Guest]

Re: how does the mind stack the cards, discussion/Brandywine's theory.

 

If we accept that there is an environment where syncronicity can exist, then in a way, doesn't the mind already know what's in the reading - the object and the image simply coming together at a particular point and time? The reading just reflects what is, like a mirror.  Maybe?

[StarWanderer]

Thank you for sharing the article! It's nice to know there are journalists who want to ask genuine questions about why people practice tarot.
I've seen many articles that mock tarot or other forms of divination, especially due to scammers being associated with us, so the writer never even formulates the question, "How does it work?" Just "Does this woo woo stuff work?" Like as if it's black and white.
So I consider myself a Jungian influenced reader, so I think as I read, I'm connecting to the inner parts of my psyche. I also believe each of us is a microcosm of the universe and that we each get a slice of truth about our reality. We're able to tap into that inner knowing with these cards.
As some mentioned before, it's not just the tarot cards that make it magical. It's us coming together that makes it work.
The cards are the stimuli, which have been well constructed to reflect core aspects of reality, and we are the reservoirs that they infuse into. We then see what possible patterns could be emerging through the cards.

[nord_drache]

Nice to see Barleywine sharing his experience and wisdom like he did on AT, his replies have helped me out on a number of occasions. Since I probably didn't say it then . . . THANK YOU BARLEYWINE !

We should all remember that we build our community by sharing experience and wisdom, now onto the topic at hand . . .

This thread is timely for me as I have wondered lately how virtual / phone readings can work . . .

During my pondering I seemed to remember mention of the cosmic consciousness and talk that much of things psychic and miraculous can be explained by quantum physics & entanglement . (Interesting how the atheists and cynics are using a scientific theory to explain what they repeatedly call superstition . . .)

What I know is for me normal readings work.

What comes up is so specific to me and the situation.

Many people speak about destiny and paths in life. Maybe down deep being "religious" and not purely secular I see Tarot / divination as a way we can tune into the vibrations of the cosmic plan - maybe that explains distant readings too? 🤨 🤔

 

I dabbled with Tarot owning a RW deck in my youth . . . didn't work. I think I was neither mature enough or secure in my spirituality for it to stay in my life. Fast forward to 7 or so years ago, living with grief & depression and being in a tumultuous time. Around that time I tried a few of the virtual readings through a couple sites - they resonated and were spot on. Around that time I was also very interested in the psychic fairs. My big sister's advice at the time was to see a psychic - this from a religious woman involved in our church and even in its council. I decided to get a Tarot deck and found the Alchemy deck on eBay - it struck a chord and now is like an long term very good friend. It will tell me what I need to here without sugar coating like a best friend can only do. A visit to that psychic was pivotal for me connecting me to those I have lost and revealing things I needed to know. Shortly after joined AT where I learned much more and was introduced to the need for & practicality of having multiple decks / a deck collection.

 

So often we grope for explanations to things we don't understand and maybe never will. Think about how science gropes with how gravity works (beyond the fact things knocked off a table fall to the floor). I remember a friend who years ago showed me a book that showed that God could be proved mathematically (?!?!) (Faith works for me 🙂 ) I often wonder why we need to know how it works when simply put IT WORKS. 

Everyone needs to follow the path that works and provides clarity for them, thought I would share my thoughts & experiences.

 

Jim

[TheLoracular]

2 hours ago, nord_drache said:

This thread is timely for me as I have wondered lately how virtual / phone readings can work . . .

I would never be able to explain the "how".   Back when I used to do it, it honestly wasn't different in terms of rapport with querents on the phone than it was reading at a street fair or a school lunch room 🙂    The querents talked, I asked questions while shuffling the cards to ensure we were on the same page and established the specific question they wanted to start with.  I laid the cards down and described what I saw, what it symbolized broadly and in context of their question and situation, listened to their response.

For me, reader-querent rapport was not essential but it sure improved the quality of the reading.  And there are people I know "too well" and I'm too opinionated about for me to think I could give them the kind of objective and accurate reading of even if we can sit over hot beverages and geeks for hours.   There are people I've felt rapport with after exchanging 4-5 sentences in a grocery store or the first minute of a phone call.  There are others where its a struggle to talk to them at all because we have none, no matter how often our paths cross and I can't pinpoint what qualities or traits cause or impair rapport.   Except one.

 

 Sincerity  is one of the big traits that enables me to have rapport and do really good readings for people by phone.  They can be mad/glad/sad/drunk and anywhere on the mental health and wellness spectrum, but if they start talking sincerely about how they feel and the details of their situation,  I can get very precise in my details and what I have to say they say is "spot-on" and helpful.  

 

 

[nord_drache]

@TheLoracular  Thank you for your experience and perspective. I don't think sincerity / rapport would be an issue, I would just wonder if the distance would create a disconnect between reader and querent.

[katrinka]

2 hours ago, nord_drache said:

I would just wonder if the distance would create a disconnect between reader and querent.

Not at all.
Not only do phone and email readings work, readings on world affairs work.
We certainly didn't have Biden or Trump on the phone when reading on the last election, yet a lot of us correctly predicted the outcome.

[nord_drache]

True. I did an experiment where I "read" one of the leaders. I don't follow polls or anything like that.

All I know is that things said he was currently satisfied but in for disappointment . . .

and what do you know the conservatives lost . . .

 

Truth be told when I finished I knew I was right.

Still a little thrown off . . .

Edited September 22, 2021 by nord_drache
forgot something

[InternationalIcon]

I'm always so grateful and amazed by the fact that tarot reading DOES work, that it feels importunate and pushy to be demanding to know HOW it works ....  I think I'm willing to let that operation remain dark to me for now.  It's not the technique, no matter how precise.  It's not the pictures, no matter how pretty.  It's not who shuffles them.  It's not even if the cards are physical or virtual.  But it does have something to do with awareness, openness, willingness and the ability to articulate.

Edited December 29, 2021 by InternationalIcon

[hana]

i was not believe in tarot till i experience it myself its really helpful  

[Eric13]

On 8/22/2018 at 2:24 PM, Saturn Celeste said:

In most people's minds, "Tarot card reading" means a woman in flowing robes, leaning over a small table in a candlelit room, foretelling impending doom.

 

But that's not really what Tarot cards are about. In fact, they're not even really meant to tell your fortune or future. According to The Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn, "The most powerful sources of information come from within; the Tarot aids in coming in contact with one's Higher Self."

 

But what does that mean? In this article, we'll look at the various ideas about where Tarot cards come from, what they mean and how a deck of cards can possibly tell you anything about yourself. You'll learn why it matters where the cards fall and why you don't have to be a psychic to do a Tarot reading.

Types of Readings

 

There are actually two different types of Tarot readings: question readings and open readings.

 

Question Readings

In question readings, you are addressing a specific question. Tarot is not intended to answer specific yes or no questions. Most say it also shouldn't be used to make decisions, but instead should be used as a guide to help you make the decision yourself. For this reason, the way a question is stated is very important. According to Joan Bunning, a Tarot reader and teacher, questions should:

 

• Keep your options open: If you have the answer before the reading, then you're not allowing the cards to guide your overall decision. Bunning gives this example: Asking how you could encourage your mother-in-law to move out, as opposed to asking how you can get along better with her, is narrowing the scope of the true question by answering it before you even get started.
• Find the best level of detail: Your question should be focused, but not overly detailed. Rather than looking at one particular aspect of a problem, find a way to look more broadly at it. For example, rather than asking how you can make your home life less chaotic, ask how you can better balance kid schedules and adult schedules. That is a focused question. But do not go so far as to ask how you can coordinate baseball, soccer and Cub Scout schedules and still have family time -- that's too detailed. Only include the minimum level of detail needed in order to express what you want to learn from the cards.
• Focus on yourself: If the reading is for yourself, make sure your question focuses on you rather than on someone else who you think may be the root of your problem. For example, asking why your son is experimenting with drugs is focusing on him, not you. Asking what role you play in your son's decision to experiment with drugs brings the focus of the question back to you.
• Stay neutral: In order to stay open to other points of view, your question has to be neutral and not convey a preconceived notion that your view is necessarily the right one. The cards can give you guidance if you ask for it. For example, asking why you're doing more work around the house than your spouse isn't neutral; asking how you can get more cooperation from your spouse when it comes to housework is neutral.
• Be positive: Make sure your question is stated in a positive rather than negative way. Instead of asking why a specific event hasn't happened, ask what you can do to help make that event happen.

 

 

Open Readings

Open readings address the larger aspects of your life rather than a specific problem area or question. They're usually done when you're entering a new phase of life, such as getting married, graduating from college or starting a family. You can somewhat direct the reading if you have a general area you want to cover, such as your career or health, but that's as specific as the direction gets.

And the years Ive been here, happily, Ive final read this OP by Saturn Celeste. I have to say Im glad I did. Its a good reminder/refresher. 

"According to The Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn, "The most powerful sources of information come from within; the Tarot aids in coming in contact with one's Higher Self."

I would say this is what I have to keep. This is a great post for everyone I think. 

[Guest]

when cards "talk" about things the reader shouldn't know it all feels uncanny and a spooky. In physics, there is this phenomenon called quantum entanglement. Even when particles are far apart, a change in one of them will force the other one to change as well. Just because they were in contact somewhere before, the particles are still able to "communicate" with each other. Maybe Tarot is our way of communication too. The reader asks the question, and in an unexplainable way they can reach into the past or the future and check the entanglement of things they ask about.

[The_Aeon]

Hii

I think tarot is all about connecting.

If you are connected you can bring the messages.

Actually if you are connected you can bring information from anything.

 

[Barleywine]

On 3/26/2021 at 12:30 AM, Guest said:

If we accept that there is an environment where syncronicity can exist, then in a way, doesn't the mind already know what's in the reading - the object and the image simply coming together at a particular point and time? The reading just reflects what is, like a mirror.  Maybe?

I just read back through this fascinating thread that I haven't been involved in since 2020. My thinking has come a long way since then, helped along by my daily blog posts (some of them admittedly curmudgeonly about the state of tarot culture in the 21st Century). The above quote nails what French tarot writer Joseph Maxwell thought about "how tarot works:"
 

Useful though rational perception may be to the cartomant, it is only an adjunct to the gift of vaticination, that is, the faculty of being able to read the information possessed by the enquirer about his past, present and future. Coming events cast a shadow before them; each individual has a presentiment about his own destiny, which may remain latent: the normal processes of consciousness do not include such presentiments.
 

Someone on another tarot page put it succinctly: "A tarot reading tells us 'what we didn't know we knew.'" I think the process by which that foreknowledge gets into the cards is quite subtle and isn't really a function of tactile, mind-hand coordination. I believe there is some kind of communion going on between querent and cards that produces a mutually agreeable "snapshot" of the seeker's circumstances in the cards drawn for the reading. (I won't talk about remote readings; I've done some but I'm not much of a believer since I think they can run afoul of subjective bias, mind-reading and intuitive guesswork). I've been reading that modern Jungian psychologists have done away with the idea of "subconscious mind" as a New Age anachronism and now go solely with "Unconscious" and "Conscious." I used to think the subconscious is an intermediary or channel for higher knowledge, but perhaps we're in closer contact to the latter than we thought; what the tarot is capable of mirroring may just be the "unvarnished truth"  that only needs to be brought into focus through the act of "unconsciously" selecting just the right cards (or their close cousins, since more than one card combination can tell the same tale) to create a compelling and substantially accurate narrative. I don't truly know how it works (although I've got loads of ideas) but I've definitely seen it work.

Edited January 17, 2024 by Barleywine

[Twinkle]

I think this article is well written for general readers. Several years ago, I discussed Jung's study and its relationship with Tarot with a student of psychology. She interrupted me, and asked me not to insult Jung. It was quite a shock to me. Clearly she knew nothing about Jung's interest in how divination works, and she hates people mixing her profession with metaphysics. 

 

In these years I found some people think astrology more 'scientific' than Tarot. It 'makes more senses' with the graphs and long analysis. Telling fortunes out of a deck of papar cards are less convincing. I found it quite interesting and irony that some people claim themself to be materialists, but will believe metaphysics in a scientific form. Do they really find it essential to understand how it works, whether it works scientifically? Or they just need it to look scientific, so they can persuade their rigid senses to believe it?

Edited June 5, 2024 by Twinkle

[Misterei]

2 hours ago, Twinkle said:

I think this article is well written for general readers. Several years ago, I discussed Jung's study and its relationship with Tarot with a student of psychology. She interrupted me, and asked me not to insult Jung. It was quite a shock to me. Clearly she knew nothing about Jung's interest in how divination works, and she hates people mixing her profession with metaphysics. 

LOL I'm a fortune-teller and I hate people mixing my profession with psychology! 🤣

 

On a more serious note, the article was full of nonsense and the common tropes that get bandied around the endless cut & paste that has replaced scholarship and critical thinking. For example the article says Tarot decks can have any number of cards. Dead wrong. Tarot has 78 cards. If it doesn't have 78 cards, it's an oracle deck, a kipper deck, whatever. Tarot has 78.

 

Plus the usual anti-fortune telling propaganda which is used to psychologize, white-wash, and mainstream Tarot.

 

2 hours ago, Twinkle said:

In these years I found some people think astrology more 'scientific' than Tarot.

n a way, it is. But then again we can also say that Tarot and Astrology are sister sciences. I find it fascinating that many people go on about how Tarot readers shouldn't charge money and just do it for free while very few people go around demanding free astrology readings.

 

I think this is b/c you actually have to study astrology to be any good at it. Ya gotta Know Stuff. Whereas any idiot can pick up a pack of Tarots and say anything and call it "reading cards".

 

Personally, I respect Tarot readers who've put their time in studying Tarot. It's history. It's philosophy. It's esoteric roots. It's numerology. And even it's astrology.

 

Both astrology and Tarot take something "extra" beyond study to make a good reader. The ghost in the machine. Intuition. Psychic insight. Siddhis. Call it what you will. Both system blend science with Something Else to work as they can and should.

Edited June 5, 2024 by Misterei

[nord_drache]

6 hours ago, Misterei said:

I think this is b/c you actually have to study astrology to be any good at it. Ya gotta Know Stuff. Whereas any idiot can pick up a pack of Tarots and say anything and call it "reading cards".

The idea that any idiot can do a "reading" is a symptom of our instant expert (university of the internet) . . . I know I have so much more to learn, even then the results surprise.

 

Quote

. . . Both astrology and Tarot take something "extra" beyond study to make a good reader. The ghost in the machine. Intuition. Psychic insight. Siddhis. Call it what you will. Both system blend science with Something Else to work as they can and should.

 

I agree . . . also what some might see as an alchemy in the interactions. I think some other things are also required . . .

Trust (in oneself / ones instinct / the reader one chooses)

An open mind. Over 40 years ago I tried to get into Tarot but all I can say it didn't sit well with me. Between then and now a good friend of ours gave us each sets of hand crafted Rune stones and guide book - I may not have looked at it with much seriousness. In the early 2000's I had issues with work and for some reason pulled them out, along with a simplified copy of the I-ching (used coins/odds evens) and it all was a help. Fast forward 10-12 years ago . . . troubles again plus grief (anniversary of Mom's passing) and I was exposed to Tarot and the concept that the deck should connect with the reader - I found Alchemy's 1977 England Tarot, and away I went . . .  I guess along with my sister's advice that at the time maybe I should even try a psychic - also mind opening.

and maybe finally maturity - with maturity we can consider the unvarnished truth as that, and more.

 

Some of the the "tales" within tarot may have some other reasons for existing . . .

Probably the readings for free was so a reader wasn't mercenary or tweaked the results for their own advantage, but at the same time I remember hearing about crossing the palm with silver (beyond silver's traits) if this is money, it would prove the querent is showing a level of respect for what the reader brings and seriousness about the act of the reading.

The not reading for loved ones could be from a need for impartiality.

Many of the rules could be flexible depending on the reader.

 

Those are my thoughts . . .

Jim