Prophetic tarot VS healing tarot. Your thoughts on this?

January 26, 2020

Hi everyone, hoping you're having a wonderful day. 💫

I don't know if this subject has been already discussed here (probably did), but I wanted to share with you a post that one of the tarot reader that I follow relayed on her social media.

In my case, I always felt uncomfortable to describe my tarot work as prophetic or divinatory. I rather prefer seeing it as self-development/analytic/for healing purposes. But this lack of comfort might be also because I'm at the beginning of my journey with tarot, and I'm not always sure of myself.

It's a debate in my mind especially as people that I read for always ask me to predict things for them even though I let them know in advance It's not the purpose of the reading.

👉👉 What about you? Would you describe your readings as predictions of the future or simple advices ?

Do you feel confortable saying that you can predict what will happen ?

I would love to know your thoughts on that !

the post:

January 26, 2020

I think actually predictive readings can be really comforting and healing, knowing that it's going to turn out okay and we will be alright is comforting. Of course it's much more unreliable than a present or issue reading, we cannot guarantee what will happen and our lives change a lot but it's one possible path in future ahead.

In the last few years it's become a tarot trend that "fortune telling" or predictive is bad and self-development tarot is good, although just in the last 2 years I have noticed a shift from that idea. I am proudly a fortune teller tarot user and enjoy predictions, I can't guarantee they will come true but I think you can use tarot in many different ways. I use it to help people in their situation and for what is coming up. Knowing what could come up in future is also healing, knowing things will get better or something difficult could happen helps you prepare. I think the negative view of predictive tarot makes it overly simplistic. Use it however it is helpful to you and others, but don't rely on it as a crutch, you have to keep your free will as a human! It all blurs together in the end, helping someone with a reading about choices and options and what happens in future from their selected choices, blurs both areas. Tarot is complex and works in multiple ways and goes into the past / present and future even if you try to keep it in one place 🙂

January 26, 2020

Well, if you advice someone based on what you see in the cards then how can that not involve the future? I mean, what defines a piece of good advice anyway? Isn’t it that we think it will help us going forward? And if we think that a deck can reveal the future, then isn’t any advice likely going to have taken the future into account?

I also think that one mustn’t forget the healing and nourishing aspects that predictive readings can hold. Do we not want to be shown what we can do to impact our future? Would we not want to be forewarned so we can prepare or make changes to try and prevent a scenario that we are dreading? Sometimes a reading that reveals future events can be the factor that allows a person to keep up the hope or regain their faith.

And finally: I would like to provide a little caution as to making too many assumptions about what will empower or help someone else. Sometimes it’s not our job to try and facilitate healing, but simply to provide the sitter with the reading and the answer that they came for.

January 26, 2020

10 minutes ago, DanielJUK said:

I think actually predictive readings can be really comforting and healing, knowing that it's going to turn out okay and we will be alright is comforting. Of course it's much more unreliable than a present or issue reading, we cannot guarantee what will happen and our lives change a lot but it's one possible path in future ahead.

In the last few years it's become a tarot trend that "fortune telling" or predictive is bad and self-development tarot is good, although just in the last 2 years I have noticed a shift from that idea. I am proudly a fortune teller tarot user and enjoy predictions, I can't guarantee they will come true but I think you can use tarot in many different ways. I use it to help people in their situation and for what is coming up. Knowing what could come up in future is also healing, knowing things will get better or something difficult could happen helps you prepare. I think the negative view of predictive tarot makes it overly simplistic. Use it however it is helpful to you and others, but don't rely on it as a crutch, you have to keep your free will as a human! It all blurs together in the end, helping someone with a reading about choices and options and what happens in future from their selected choices, blurs both areas. Tarot is complex and works in multiple ways and goes into the past / present and future even if you try to keep it in one place 🙂

Well said!

January 26, 2020

1 hour ago, theholysticvagabond said:

Would you describe your readings as predictions of the future or simple advices ?

I am always very clear with people who want predictions by saying that we live in a free will universe. So we cannot predict the future. We can take a look at a probable future based on conditions as they exist at the time of the reading.

So I describe my readings as taking a look at a probable future and as advice. People are often looking for a certain result in the future. I usually advise them about the best courses of action to take to optimize getting the result that they want.

January 26, 2020

I'd have to agree too.

In my humble opinion the best tarot reads are the ones that help you understand the question that is asked, be that predictive, healing, spiritual or psychological. In my experience tarot can help on so many different planes in so many aspects of life it's not only hard to pin it down to one but also a little ill-considered to think in this way. Tarot like all magickal tools are there to open doors and widen perception not close or narrow them down.

Edited January 26, 2020 by AeonHorus

January 26, 2020

Yeah for me I don't like the idea of predictive readings in a set in stone, "This is what's going to happen" way. I always use the term "seeing trajectories". Like for me there is definitely a predictive side to Tarot, but I feel it works in the same way as watching a train going along a track. Let's say there are many tracks, but it's right now heading down one. I think the Tarot can tell you where THAT track leads, and say "Well if things keep going as they are, this is what's gonna happen", but once someone has that knowledge, they're perfectly free to change tracks. In some cases getting that train to change tracks might require an immense amount of effort, but I feel it can still always be done.

I have really had trouble deciding what I am and am not comfortable with as a reader myself, I have done a few predictive readings, no one came back to let me know if they came true or not but I can only hope they were helpful. There is a degree to which I do not ASK for or WANT predictive readings though. Like in the last reading I requested, I debated whether or not I wanted to ask it predictively, "Will I make my new album this year?" But honestly, be the answer yes, or be the answer no, I don't think it would have done much. I INTEND to make this album this year, I'm GOING to, if the cards said yes? It might have been a bit encouraging, but I would only be hearing what I already know, I'm doing this. If the cards said no? I'd have been like "whatever, no deck of cards is gonna tell me I'm not doing this" and done it anyway lol. So in that case, a predictive reading made no sense, which is why I worded it "HOW can I best complete my album".

But it can get very complicated sometimes, there are some predictive questions I'm comfortable asking/answering because it's out of someone's control and can help with a decision. One time a sitter wanted to know which one of their professors at college would give them the best recommendation for a job they wanted. I was totally cool with reading that predictively, they could only choose one (can't remember why) and they wanted to know which choice would bring the best outcome, no prob. But when people ask "Will I find love this year" I get uncomfortable, to me that's a loaded question that has to do with where you're at in life, and I often times feel like "if I say no, they will walk away disappointed, if I say yes they will look forward to this so much they might stop living in the present", so it just... depends. I can't wait till I can really sort out all my feelings on this and go "Ok here's what I'm ok with, here's what I'm not", but thus far in my Tarot journey I have found that those are tough questions to answer.

And the last thing I'll add is just, I still wonder quite simply, "How much of our future is it even healthy for us to know?"

Edited January 26, 2020 by Symph

January 26, 2020

6 hours ago, DanielJUK said:

Knowing what could come up in future is also healing, knowing things will get better or something difficult could happen helps you prepare. I think the negative view of predictive tarot makes it overly simplistic.

Tarot is complex and works in multiple ways and goes into the past / present and future even if you try to keep it in one place 🙂

@DanielJUK I wish querents would always see things like that because I had too often people that just got frustrated when I predicted bad things.

Overall, I think you're right. Tarot is very complex. When I read for myself, I do try to predict and it actually helped me several times. So you can't just throw out the fortune telling part. Maybe some people are better at predicting and others are better at more "rational" use of it. At the end it's a tool and everyone use it its own way.

6 hours ago, Raggydoll said:

And finally: I would like to provide a little caution as to making too many assumptions about what will empower or help someone else. Sometimes it’s not our job to try and facilitate healing, but simply to provide the sitter with the reading and the answer that they came for.

@Raggydoll Yes, I think you made a point !

Wanting always to be "the healer" can be very tricky and even with good intentions, we can go over our job of reader. At the end, I guess we are just "channels" between spirit guides/subconscious/whatever words works better for you and the querent.

January 26, 2020

5 hours ago, Natural Mystic Guide said:

So I describe my readings as taking a look at a probable future and as advice. People are often looking for a certain result in the future. I usually advise them about the best courses of action to take to optimize getting the result that they want.

@Natural Mystic Guide "Probable future" is also how I like to present things.

This is a clever way of doing it.

5 hours ago, AeonHorus said:

Tarot like all magickal tools are there to open doors and widen perception not close or narrow them down.

@AeonHorus I really like this sentence.

No matter how we use tarot, at the end, if it open doors, it did the job.

January 26, 2020

5 hours ago, DanielJUK said:

I think actually predictive readings can be really comforting and healing, knowing that it's going to turn out okay and we will be alright is comforting.

Yes, people are often worried over nothing.
And people who know me already know which side of the debate I'm on, lol.

5 hours ago, DanielJUK said:

course it's much more unreliable than a present or issue reading, we cannot guarantee what will happen and our lives change a lot but it's one possible path in future ahead.

This I don't agree with. If you're going to misinterpret a reading, it's just as likely that you'll miscall one focused on the present or issues as one focused on the future.

Maybe it's harder to prove a psychological reading wrong ("You daddy issues are subconscious, that's why you're not aware of them. You repress things. You're in denial!" But it can be wrong nonetheless. And potentially very dangerous, the way a shyster therapist is dangerous. Remember all this? https://www.thecut.com/2016/11/remembering-childhood-trauma-and-abuse-that-never-happened.html

And while I do consider myself predictive reader, I read on the present as well. But the kinds of present readings I do are "Where are my keys?" type things, or "What are so-and-so's intentions?" not the kinds of things self-improvement readers like to read on.

6 hours ago, DanielJUK said:

In the last few years it's become a tarot trend that "fortune telling" or predictive is bad and self-development tarot is good, although just in the last 2 years I have noticed a shift from that idea.

I've been seeing it for much longer. But than I've always gravitated towards a Lenormand/playing cards type crowd. It's only a faction of modern Tarot readers who say "predictive is bad". And in reality, there are also Tarot readers who never bought into that and never stopped reading predictively. Then, around 2011, there was that Lenormand bandwagon and people really started taking back the term fortuneteller and calling themselves sibyls and whatnot.

1 hour ago, Symph said:

And the last thing I'll add is just, I still wonder quite simply, "How much of our future is it even healthy for us to know?"

Assuming that knowing the future is unhealthy (and I really don't see that), hearing something from a fortuneteller is not the same as knowing. Most folks take a reading with a grain of salt. If I tell them to be careful around water, they'll keep that in mind if they're contemplating going on a cruise, but they won't stop bathing.

I think we should treat our clients like sane adults, not assume that we're responsible for their "healing" or "psychological well being." That's arrogant.

January 26, 2020

1 hour ago, Symph said:

I can't wait till I can really sort out all my feelings on this and go "Ok here's what I'm ok with, here's what I'm not", but thus far in my Tarot journey I have found that those are tough questions to answer.

And the last thing I'll add is just, I still wonder quite simply, "How much of our future is it even healthy for us to know?"

@Symph It might sounds weird to say that but I'm kind of reassured to know that I'm not the only one having a hard time positioning themselves on that subject. 🙈

I really do feel you on the fact that sometimes, some predictive questions don't make sense. And re-questionning in a better way like "how can i" or "where do i need to put my focus" is more helpful. Maybe we are talking about the wrong debate and it's not about prediction vs healing but more about good questions vs bad questions.

Ahhh, It's so tricky. 😂

January 26, 2020

6 hours ago, Natural Mystic Guide said:

I am always very clear with people who want predictions by saying that we live in a free will universe. So we cannot predict the future. We can take a look at a probable future based on conditions as they exist at the time of the reading.

This very much. Any reading we give assumes that the situation is as it is and will remain so. As soon as you change the parameters, the outcome possibilities also change. Otherwise why get a reading - you can't do anything with the information you get, and whatever you might think you are doing because of what you were told would have happened anyway - that's predestination for you !

January 26, 2020

19 minutes ago, theholysticvagabond said:

@Symph It might sounds weird to say that but I'm kind of reassured to know that I'm not the only one having a hard time positioning themselves on that subject. 🙈

I really do feel you on the fact that sometimes, some predictive questions don't make sense. And re-questionning in a better way like "how can i" or "where do i need to put my focus" is more helpful. Maybe we are talking about the wrong debate and it's not about prediction vs healing but more about good questions vs bad questions.

Ahhh, It's so tricky. 😂

It is I guess for people like you and me, that's why I get kinda jealous of people like @katrinka haha She's just so dang sure of what she's doing and how she feels about it! I WANT THAT. I do disagree however about the idea that those of us who feel these questions are important are somehow underestimating the maturity of our sitters, and being "arrogant". We're being cautious and realistic, and possibly just ignorant or naive meaning... we worry about it because we haven't done it enough to see how it goes. Perhaps someone like Katrinka has been exposed to enough readings and seen the results long enough to feel we worry over nothing, but when this is all new and you're an analyzer (like myself) you can't help but wonder about all the possibilities and the desire to do no harm can make it difficult to know what works and what doesn't.

I think the answer will come as we just continue to read, and I'd even encourage you to try some readings you AREN'T comfortable with, but maybe with a person you DO trust who is into the Tarot world and has had many readings before so you know they know what to expect. Cause I've done that before, and then when I saw the result felt like "Oh wow that wasn't a big deal at all, I don't feel bad about that" but on the flip side, I actually did give a reading one time that afterward I felt bad about. I don't wanna go into details on that one, but just... for me I kind of have to do it to see what kind of taste it leaves in my mouth afterward, and I think that's ok. You're not gonna ruin anyone's life I'm pretty positive about that at least haha

January 26, 2020

13 minutes ago, katrinka said:

Yes, people are often worried over nothing.
And people who know me already know which side of the debate I'm on, lol.

This I don't agree with. If you're going to misinterpret a reading, it's just as likely that you'll miscall one focused on the present or issues as one focused on the future.

Maybe it's harder to prove a psychological reading wrong ("You daddy issues are subconscious, that's why you're not aware of them. You repress things. You're in denial!" But it can be wrong nonetheless. And potentially very dangerous, the way a shyster therapist is dangerous. Remember all this? https://www.thecut.com/2016/11/remembering-childhood-trauma-and-abuse-that-never-happened.html

And while I do consider myself predictive reader, I read on the present as well. But the kinds of present readings I do are "Where are my keys?" type things, or "What are so-and-so's intentions?" not the kinds of things self-improvement readers like to read on.

I've been seeing it for much longer. But than I've always gravitated towards a Lenormand/playing cards type crowd. It's only a faction of modern Tarot readers who say "predictive is bad". And in reality, there are also Tarot readers who never bought into that and never stopped reading predictively. Then, around 2011, there was that Lenormand bandwagon and people really started taking back the term fortuneteller and calling themselves sibyls and whatnot.

Assuming that knowing the future is unhealthy (and I really don't see that), hearing something from a fortuneteller is not the same as knowing. Most folks take a reading with a grain of salt. If I tell them to be careful around water, they'll keep that in mind if they're contemplating going on a cruise, but they won't stop bathing.

I think we should treat our clients like sane adults, not assume that we're responsible for their "healing" or "psychological well being." That's arrogant.

@katrinka Your point of view is really interesting. thanks for sharing!

I would maybe just comment on the last point.

The word "Healing" can be taken at different levels. We're not here to "save" people or fix psychological issues.

But if we'd like to try to make people feel a bit better, I don't see it as arrogant. The ones that don't need it? That's ok, we can still work this out.

But in my case, having readings from others helped me "healed", like an extra push in the work I did myself to be better. (and i'm sane lol)

January 26, 2020

1 minute ago, gregory said:

Otherwise why get a reading - you can't do anything with the information you get, and whatever you might think you are doing because of what you were told would have happened anyway - that's predestination for you !

I really like the way you said that Gregory, that's how I feel too. A future reading that was 100 percent set in stone just doesn't sound very useful to me. We've got to be able to do something with the information we get.

January 26, 2020

8 minutes ago, Symph said:

It is I guess for people like you and me, that's why I get kinda jealous of people like @katrinka haha She's just so dang sure of what she's doing and how she feels about it! I WANT THAT. I do disagree however about the idea that those of us who feel these questions are important are somehow underestimating the maturity of our sitters, and being "arrogant". We're being cautious and realistic, and possibly just ignorant or naive meaning... we worry about it because we haven't done it enough to see how it goes. Perhaps someone like Katrinka has been exposed to enough readings and seen the results long enough to feel we worry over nothing, but when this is all new and you're an analyzer (like myself) you can't help but wonder about all the possibilities and the desire to do no harm can make it difficult to know what works and what doesn't.

I think the answer will come as we just continue to read, and I'd even encourage you to try some readings you AREN'T comfortable with, but maybe with a person you DO trust who is into the Tarot world and has had many readings before so you know they know what to expect. Cause I've done that before, and then when I saw the result felt like "Oh wow that wasn't a big deal at all, I don't feel bad about that" but on the flip side, I actually did give a reading one time that afterward I felt bad about. I don't wanna go into details on that one, but just... for me I kind of have to do it to see what kind of taste it leaves in my mouth afterward, and I think that's ok. You're not gonna ruin anyone's life I'm pretty positive about that at least haha

@Symph 💯💯 I want that confidence toooo 😂

You're completely right. And your message gives me kind of hope!

Conclusion >>>> just more practice + stop over worrying.

January 27, 2020

"Set in stone"? Where did that even come from?

Some things in life are avoidable, some aren't. The avoidable things don't magically become unavoidable just because they came up in readings.

The person who doesn't get on the plane doesn't die in the crash. Forewarned is forearmed. 😉

January 27, 2020

8 hours ago, theholysticvagabond said:

@katrinka Your point of view is really interesting. thanks for sharing!

I would maybe just comment on the last point.

The word "Healing" can be taken at different levels. We're not here to "save" people or fix psychological issues.

But if we'd like to try to make people feel a bit better, I don't see it as arrogant. The ones that don't need it? That's ok, we can still work this out.

But in my case, having readings from others helped me "healed", like an extra push in the work I did myself to be better. (and i'm sane lol)

You're talking about framing, being encouraging. And that's part of predictive reading, saying things like "You've got this!" along with any bad news that comes up.

What I meant by arrogant is people who think they know better than their client, the ones who refuse qustions as they are and edit them into something else.

Imagine paying $100+ for a reading and having someone do that to you.

January 27, 2020

5 minutes ago, katrinka said:

Some things in life are avoidable, some aren't. The avoidable things don't magically become unavoidable just because they came up in readings.

8 hours ago, katrinka said:

This I don't agree with. If you're going to misinterpret a reading, it's just as likely that you'll miscall one focused on the present or issues as one focused on the future.

January 27, 2020

Also, what Katrinka said: just because someone does predictive readings that does not mean that they don’t read on the present or on the past.

I read on all those things. I also tackle self care topics and spiritual questions; I pretty much read on anything the sitter wants. But almost all the people who come to me for readings - whether they ask about the past, present or the future (or their spiritual path or their physical wellbeing..) - they do so because they know my approach, which is psychic readings. Psychic readings do involve, by their very nature, the ‘unknowable’ (for lack of better words). And while I do often give advice, it is based on what I see (either in the cards or in my visions), not on what I have deduced by contemplating the client and their circumstances. Those things could go very wrong very quickly if you aren’t a professional counselor. And even professional counselors would likely want a bit more time with their client before they hand out advice or make assumptions.

January 27, 2020

2 hours ago, katrinka said:

"Set in stone"? Where did that even come from?

Some things in life are avoidable, some aren't. The avoidable things don't magically become unavoidable just because they came up in readings.

The person who doesn't get on the plane doesn't die in the crash. Forewarned is forearmed. 😉

If you are predicting, you are telling the sitter what is going to happen. If you say "this will happen UNLESS you do xyz", you are no longer actually predicting.

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/predict

Quote

Predict: to say that an event or action will happen in the future, especially as a result of knowledge or experience:

WILL HAPPEN. You can't be the only person never to have spotted the sitter who came back to complain "you said he'd leave his wife and he hasn't."

You KNOW there are sitters who believe that if you say this will happen, it WILL. That's why I don't do prediction as such. Changing that dame's question to read "what can I do differently in the hope of making this relationship work out" would give pointers she could use while she waits. And if he doesn't leave his wife, at least she will have useful stuff she can use next time she is in a relationship.

As to "don't get on that plane", may I remind you of Samara, katrinka ? YOU know that story ! :rofl: Talking evasive action doesn't always prevent disaster.

Edited January 27, 2020 by gregory

January 27, 2020

17 minutes ago, gregory said:

If you are predicting, you are telling the sitter what is going to happen. If you say "this will happen UNLESS you do xyz", you are no longer actually predicting.

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/predict

WILL HAPPEN. You can't be the only person never to have spotted the sitter who came back to complain "you said he'd leave his wife and he hasn't."

You KNOW there are sitters who believe that if you say this will happen, it WILL. That's why I don't do prediction as such. Changing that dame's question to read "what can I do differently in the hope of making this relationship work out" would give pointers she could use while she waits. And if he doesn't leave his wife, at least she will have useful stuff she can use next time she is in a relationship.

As to "don't get on that plane", may I remind you of Samara, katrinka ? YOU know that story ! Talking evasive action doesn't always prevent disaster.

I am not sure if I am using the right terminology but I call it predictions when I discuss what I see for the future. And I definitely of the opinion that what is seen is what will happen if unexpected factors do not play in (certain situations will also have far more factors than others). I believe that certain things are unavoidable while others aren't, just as I believe that some things can be made less serious if we act on them. Maybe this is the wrong usage of the term, but I don't really know what else to call it. (Please tell me if you know of a better description).

I can give you a couple of examples, that are all either made up or heavily altered. But they give you an idea of what I mean. These are of course very dramatic examples and not representative of the majority of the readings that are done, but still... these things can absolutely happen, and I have witnessed it myself.

The reader sees a glimpse of a serious accident that the sitter will be involved in, and the sitter is then able to recognize the dangerous situation just as it arises and they are able to act quickly so that the outcome is either made less severe or avoided. I have heard people describe "near death experiences" that would have ended very badly if they had not been forewarned and were able to respond quickly.

There could also be a situation where the sitter is forewarned about a potential health problem (like a specific condition) and they therefore seek medical care at the onset of the very first symtoms, which then leads to an early diagnosis and a much improved prognosis. I have heard people tell me that because of the reading they had, they chose not to wait (like they normally would have) but go straight to the emergency room, and that this turned out to be a very fortunate thing indeed.

I have always felt that what we see, we see for a reason. It might not be the reason we assume it to be, but that there still is a point to it. It might well be that I need there to be a point to it.

I can give another, more specific example, that is actually mine to give. About 5 years ago, I suddenly had the distinct feeling that something very bad would happen to my father. The feeling I got was that he was going to get sick and die very suddenly. I did not know what to do with that information, but I decided to speak to my sister. She took me seriously (she is well aware of my gift, you could say it runs in the family). We decided to try and talk to mom to see how dad seemed to be doing. I will admit, I procrastinated. Mom and dad was to go to a funeral the next day and I didn't want to cause more stress, so I waited yet another day before I spoke to her. It was in the morning, on a Sunday. I said that I was worried for dads health, and I just had a bad feeling. She told me that he was doing fine (he even said "Hi"! in the background and I could hear that he sounded like normal) and she said that they were about to go out for a walk together. She also said that he had a regular check up with his doctor scheduled two days later, and that she would make sure that they checked him thoroughly. Well. I suspect you can guess. My father died later that day, from a sudden heart attack. There was no way of saving him. The doctors said that even if we had gone in to the emergency room in time, his vessels were still in too bad shape. He would have died no matter what. So that is an example of an event that you cannot prevent. It did not happen because I saw it. It is just that sometimes we see things that will happen. Not everything, of course. But some things. I have no idea why we see some things and not others, just as I have no idea how some things can be prevented and not others. I have no answers and I am not sure if I would even like the answer if I heard it.

January 27, 2020

3 hours ago, gregory said:

If you are predicting, you are telling the sitter what is going to happen. If you say "this will happen UNLESS you do xyz", you are no longer actually predicting.

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/predict

WILL HAPPEN.

Well yes. "The plane will crash" - but you don't have to be on it.
Semantics, though. I don't do strictly predictions, since a lot of common questions have to do with things like how someone feels about them, what their intentions are, where is grandma's ring? etc. Things that are happening now, that "issue readers" refuse or rephrase. And then there are questions about the past, as well, and issue readers don't seem to like those, either. So in some ways, "predictive" isn't the right word. You have a point there.

A better description would be "fortunetelling", I suppose.

Quote

You can't be the only person never to have spotted the sitter who came back to complain "you said he'd leave his wife and he hasn't."

Actually, no one has ever said that to me.
Part of it is that readings have a definite time frame, so you lose accuracy if you try to read years ahead. And I explain that.
Part of it is that the cards work.
And if I've ever miscalled one of those, no one has come back to say so.

3 hours ago, gregory said:

As to "don't get on that plane", may I remind you of Samara, katrinka ? YOU know that story ! Talking evasive action doesn't always prevent disaster.

I've seen many, many versions of the Samara story. In those old pulp horror comics where the stories are introduced by the Cryptkeeper or similar, and probably on The Twilight Zone or Night Gallery, though I can't recall the details. LOL.

The closest to it that I know of in real life happened to a kid in my hometown when he was heading home from partying on graduation night. He flipped his truck, miraculously emerged unscathed and went to light a flare. Then another truck came along and killed him.

Now, it's possible that it was his time to go and there was no avoiding it. But since he was 18 years old, I'm more inclined to believe that he might have avoided it if he had not been out drunk driving on a poorly lit stretch of highway. Either way is horrible, though.

Like I said, some things are avoidable and some things aren't. And we don't always know which is which, but it's certainly worth the effort it takes to try to avert disaster.

2 hours ago, Raggydoll said:

I am not sure if I am using the right terminology but I call it predictions when I discuss what I see for the future. And I definitely of the opinion that what is seen is what will happen if unexpected factors do not play in (certain situations will also have far more factors than others). I believe that certain things are unavoidable while others aren't, just as I believe that some things can be made less serious if we act on them. Maybe this is the wrong usage of the term, but I don't really know what else to call it. (Please tell me if you know of a better description).

Don't look at me, all I could come up with was "fortunetelling," lol. Telling people about their fortune, if it will be good or bad in various areas.
Sometimes the future can be "bendy". That's a term that a friend used, and it rang true enough to stay with me. Not everything is guaranteed, obviously. It's a two edged sword - you can avert disaster, but you can also screw up something good that's trying to happen for you.

Cards help with this stuff.

Quote

The reader sees a glimpse of a serious accident that the sitter will be involved in, and the sitter is then able to recognize the dangerous situation just as it arises and they are able to act quickly so that the outcome is either made less severe or avoided. I have heard people describe "near death experiences" that would have ended very badly if they had not been forewarned and were able to respond quickly.

Exactly. Or just take precautions, like having the pepper spray readily at hand rather than buried in the bottom of one's purse.

Quote

There could also be a situation where the sitter is forewarned about a potential health problem (like a specific condition) and they therefore seek medical care at the onset of the very first symtoms, which then leads to an early diagnosis and a much improved prognosis. I have heard people tell me that because of the reading they had, they chose not to wait (like they normally would have) but go straight to the emergency room, and that this turned out to be a very fortunate thing indeed.

YES.

Quote

I have always felt that what we see, we see for a reason. It might not be the reason we assume it to be, but that there still is a point to it. It might well be that I need there to be a point to it.

I can give another, more specific example, that is actually mine to give. About 5 years ago, I suddenly had the distinct feeling that something very bad would happen to my father. The feeling I got was that he was going to get sick and die very suddenly. I did not know what to do with that information, but I decided to speak to my sister. She took me seriously (she is well aware of my gift, you could say it runs in the family). We decided to try and talk to mom to see how dad seemed to be doing. I will admit, I procrastinated. Mom and dad was to go to a funeral the next day and I didn't want to cause more stress, so I waited yet another day before I spoke to her. It was in the morning, on a Sunday. I said that I was worried for dads health, and I just had a bad feeling. She told me that he was doing fine (he even said "Hi"! in the background and I could hear that he sounded like normal) and she said that they were about to go out for a walk together. She also said that he had a regular check up with his doctor scheduled two days later, and that she would make sure that they checked him thoroughly. Well. I suspect you can guess. My father died later that day, from a sudden heart attack. There was no way of saving him. The doctors said that even if we had gone in to the emergency room in time, his vessels were still in too bad shape. He would have died no matter what. So that is an example of an event that you cannot prevent. It did not happen because I saw it. It is just that sometimes we see things that will happen. Not everything, of course. But some things. I have no idea why we see some things and not others, just as I have no idea how some things can be prevented and not others. I have no answers and I am not sure if I would even like the answer if I heard it.

Ouch. Yeah.
I don't have any answers...I think of it kind of like a bus ride. There are stops along the way where you can get off, or you can keep riding. But at the end of the line, you have to get off.

But that's just me trying to make sense of something I can't quite get my brain around. In any case, though, we shouldn't assume we're at the end of the line, since we might not be. See the doctor, carry the pepper spray.

Edited January 27, 2020 by katrinka

January 27, 2020

12 hours ago, katrinka said:

You're talking about framing, being encouraging. And that's part of predictive reading, saying things like "You've got this!" along with any bad news that comes up.

What I meant by arrogant is people who think they know better than their client, the ones who refuse qustions as they are and edit them into something else.

Imagine paying $100+ for a reading and having someone do that to you.

Mm, yes I understand.

At the end, I think we're all having the same goals with tarot. We just have different words for it: predictions, fortunetelling, healing, advising, warning.

The only real difference I can tell is that we're not having the same level of confidence about seeing the future. Maybe it's a matter of experience, or just different type of faiths. I don't know.

I'm a bit clearer on my own positioning now, thanks.

January 27, 2020

8 hours ago, Raggydoll said:

I am not sure if I am using the right terminology but I call it predictions when I discuss what I see for the future. And I definitely of the opinion that what is seen is what will happen if unexpected factors do not play in (certain situations will also have far more factors than others). I believe that certain things are unavoidable while others aren't, just as I believe that some things can be made less serious if we act on them. Maybe this is the wrong usage of the term, but I don't really know what else to call it. (Please tell me if you know of a better description).

I can give you a couple of examples, that are all either made up or heavily altered. But they give you an idea of what I mean. These are of course very dramatic examples and not representative of the majority of the readings that are done, but still... these things can absolutely happen, and I have witnessed it myself.

The reader sees a glimpse of a serious accident that the sitter will be involved in, and the sitter is then able to recognize the dangerous situation just as it arises and they are able to act quickly so that the outcome is either made less severe or avoided. I have heard people describe "near death experiences" that would have ended very badly if they had not been forewarned and were able to respond quickly.

There could also be a situation where the sitter is forewarned about a potential health problem (like a specific condition) and they therefore seek medical care at the onset of the very first symtoms, which then leads to an early diagnosis and a much improved prognosis. I have heard people tell me that because of the reading they had, they chose not to wait (like they normally would have) but go straight to the emergency room, and that this turned out to be a very fortunate thing indeed.

I have always felt that what we see, we see for a reason. It might not be the reason we assume it to be, but that there still is a point to it. It might well be that I need there to be a point to it.

I can give another, more specific example, that is actually mine to give. About 5 years ago, I suddenly had the distinct feeling that something very bad would happen to my father. The feeling I got was that he was going to get sick and die very suddenly. I did not know what to do with that information, but I decided to speak to my sister. She took me seriously (she is well aware of my gift, you could say it runs in the family). We decided to try and talk to mom to see how dad seemed to be doing. I will admit, I procrastinated. Mom and dad was to go to a funeral the next day and I didn't want to cause more stress, so I waited yet another day before I spoke to her. It was in the morning, on a Sunday. I said that I was worried for dads health, and I just had a bad feeling. She told me that he was doing fine (he even said "Hi"! in the background and I could hear that he sounded like normal) and she said that they were about to go out for a walk together. She also said that he had a regular check up with his doctor scheduled two days later, and that she would make sure that they checked him thoroughly. Well. I suspect you can guess. My father died later that day, from a sudden heart attack. There was no way of saving him. The doctors said that even if we had gone in to the emergency room in time, his vessels were still in too bad shape. He would have died no matter what. So that is an example of an event that you cannot prevent. It did not happen because I saw it. It is just that sometimes we see things that will happen. Not everything, of course. But some things. I have no idea why we see some things and not others, just as I have no idea how some things can be prevented and not others. I have no answers and I am not sure if I would even like the answer if I heard it.

Thanks for sharing your story and I'm sorry for your loss.

I guess we won't have the answer of this last questionnement, but we can just keeping faith that there is a good reason behind everything and at least we're trying our best.

Prophetic tarot VS healing tarot. Your thoughts on this?

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