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Best Tdm Deck for Beginners


TheBabelite

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8 hours ago, _R_ said:

it is a "Marteau Mark II" deck (i.e. the standard Grimaud with the dice and tulip), and not a reproduction of the 1930 fleur-de-lys edition

Interesting to note indeed!

 

For the Conver that I advised above I wanted to add as well that if the deck itself is of decent quality considering its price (not amazing though), the LWB which comes with it is wrong, not just bad but wrong (the meanings for the cards are nonsensical!)

Edited by Decan
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2 hours ago, Decan said:

Interesting to note indeed!

 

For the Conver that I advised above I wanted to add as well that if the deck itself is of decent quality considering its price (not amazing though), the LWB which comes with it is wrong, not just bad but wrong (the meanings for the cards are nonsensical!)

All the LWBs for TdMs are rubbish. They all end up in my wastepaper basket immediately I open the deck. You can't understand the TdM with a LWB. Maybe a HWB (a huge white book). But it's better to learn it by oneself. 

 

 

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Vanishingly few TdM decks come with booklets that make sense. It's sad. SO many people actually still think the meanings are the same as Waite or Thoth. (Even here, actually...)

 

Oh - I see I cross posted with Marigold...

Edited by gregory
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There are also more and more books (even in French) on the TdM that are full of weirdness and nonsense. I'd like to just advise people who're getting into the TdM that if they see a book that seems to echo strangely the RWS meanings, to not buy it. I was up at our local big bookstore recently and for the first time in years looked at the Tarot books. They don't have many. But out of the 10 of 12 I saw, only one was worth buying (which I did.) The rest were a just a vague and bad rehashing of all the errors ever made with some new age sprinklings sort of like M&Ms or Smarties added. Some authors seem to rely on rubbish books, copy them with different words, and sell them as something new.

 

BEWARE !!! 🥵 TdM is NOT Golden Dawn. It's not a prancing around in silly robes with magic wands trying to tell God how to do his work and trying to improve on it. 

 

 

Edited by Marigold
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6 minutes ago, gregory said:

Vanishingly few TdM decks come with booklets that make sense. It's sad. SO many people actually still think the meanings are the same as Waite or Thoth. (Even here, actually...)

 

Oh - I see I cross posted with Marigold...

I think some people also think that its too much of a hustle to learn a new system so instead they just try to force fit RWS meanings onto TdM decks. This seem especially true with pip cards. 

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1 minute ago, Raggydoll said:

I think some people also think that its too much of a hustle to learn a new system so instead they just try to force fit RWS meanings onto TdM decks. This seem especially true with pip cards. 

Pips are easy. Just LOOK at the cards. Look, observe. Look, observe. And then look and observe again. They're as easy as pie when you do that. Elements and numbers are also to be observed very closely. This would deserve it's own thread though I think. That's a funny word "pip". Once I remember (maybe on AtF) that I thought the word seed was better. Then someone said a seed is a pip. So I said ok. 

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1 minute ago, Marigold said:

There are also more and more books (even in French) on the TdM that are full of weirdness and nonsense. I'd like to just advise people who're getting into the TdM that if they see a book that seems to echo strangely the RWS meanings, to not buy it. I was up at our local big bookstore recently and for the first time in years looked at the Tarot books. They don't have many. But out of the 10 of 12 I saw, only one was worth buying (which I did.) The rest were a just a vague and bad rehashing of all the errors ever made with some new age sprinklings sort of like M&Ms or Smarties added. Some authors seem to rely on rubbish books, copy them with different words, and sell them as something new.

 

BEWARE !!! 🥵

 

 

Yes. Very true. Maybe we should make another thread that is simply called TdM for Beginners. It could have tips on books, decks, symbolism, reading styles, things to be aware of etc. Basically all the good stuff would be gathered there, with links to resources etc. And I could make it a sticky.. Just a suggestion! 

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Just now, Marigold said:

Pips are easy. Just LOOK at the cards. Look, observe. Look, observe. And then look and observe again. They're as easy as pie when you do that. Elements and numbers are also to be observed very closely. This would deserve it's own thread though I think. That's a funny word "pip". Once I remember (maybe on AtF) that I thought the word seed was better. Then someone said a seed is a pip. So I said ok. 

Totally. That goes for every type of deck. But I believe that some people get intimidated by the thought of having to rely on their own impressions and so they rather have keywords memorized. 

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2 minutes ago, Raggydoll said:

Totally. That goes for every type of deck. But I believe that some people get intimidated by the thought of having to rely on their own impressions and so they rather have keywords memorized. 

I understand that. But we can't memorise the Tarot. It is something that must come from our depths. The Tarot isn't OUT there... it's WITHIN. Seriously. Symph's recent experience that he recounted is a fine example of this. 

Edited by Marigold
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2 minutes ago, Marigold said:

I understand that. But we can't memorise the Tarot. It is something that must come from our depths. The Tarot isn't OUT there... it's WITHIN. Seriously. Symph's recent experience that he recounted is a fine example of this. 

I agree that we absolutely need to use our minds and our eyes, and that the intuition is an important part of every reading. But I also think it’s vital that we don’t skip the legwork. Traditional meanings, history and symbolism is what will give you a solid foundation where you can start confidently relying on your inner abilities to perceive and understand the meanings of the cards from the context of the reading.

 

Also. Did you see my suggestion about starting a separate thread? I’d like to hear everyone’s opinions on it 🙂

 

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33 minutes ago, Raggydoll said:

I agree that we absolutely need to use our minds and our eyes, and that the intuition is an important part of every reading. But I also think it’s vital that we don’t skip the legwork. Traditional meanings, history and symbolism is what will give you a solid foundation where you can start confidently relying on your inner abilities to perceive and understand the meanings of the cards from the context of the reading.

 

Also. Did you see my suggestion about starting a separate thread? I’d like to hear everyone’s opinions on it 🙂

 

Yes, you're right. We do need the history and symbolism. The meanings actually become apparent when one understands the symbolism. Not really the other way. But I also have books - I'm not deriding them. I'll write a book myself one day. I just need to find the time. Maybe when I have less family obligations. It will be self-published and free on-line. I don't want to make money out of it. 

 

Intuition is not enough. One does need some understanding of the cards as well.

 

As to your suggestion, of course this would be a big asset and I think is needed on any tarot forum

 

 

 

 

Edited by Marigold
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55 minutes ago, Raggydoll said:

Yes. Very true. Maybe we should make another thread that is simply called TdM for Beginners. It could have tips on books, decks, symbolism, reading styles, things to be aware of etc. Basically all the good stuff would be gathered there, with links to resources etc. And I could make it a sticky.. Just a suggestion! 

Great suggestion! :thumbsup:

 

ETA: I've never read with the TdM though I have the CBD (and the Grimaud is on its way). I didn't know any of the information in the last few posts members have posted here (about interpretations, how to do it and the resources to avoid). I'd really like to learn the system "the right way", so a thread would be so helpful.

Edited by Starlight
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I would welcome a thread - even a subforum. Sort of TdM for beginners from people who know what they are talking about. At the moment I am trying to cope with Jean-Michel David's book - which I think Marigold probably approves of ? but it's hard going for someone who normally rads the way I do...

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I love the small book by Lee Bursten that comes with the Universal Tarot De Marseille. I just want a straight-forward method I can apply to all pip-types, and his works for me. For folks who want to move over from RWS types, you've got to help them make those first steps, and not just carry over the meanings they already know.

(Sorry if someone else has already mentioned this).

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I made us a new thread: 

 

I changed the title so that it welcomes learning resources for every level (not just for beginners). Please jump on over there and help me make it nice. I think most of what we have been discussing here lately can continue in there. You can repeat information or link to past posts that you have made. It helps us all to find things easier. If we need a sub forum or more threads eventually then we will deal with that then. This should get us started for now :thumbsup:

 

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24 minutes ago, PathWalker said:

I love the small book by Lee Bursten that comes with the Universal Tarot De Marseille. I just want a straight-forward method I can apply to all pip-types, and his works for me. For folks who want to move over from RWS types, you've got to help them make those first steps, and not just carry over the meanings they already know.

(Sorry if someone else has already mentioned this).

 

I like that too, but some TdM aficionado said it was rubbish....

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I think it's a good starting point, gives folks some ideas about the significance of numbers, and you've got to get people thinking "I can do this" when they make the step into TdM - not blind them with so much (conflicting) detail that they just give up and go back to all those pretty pictures  . . .

 

We are talking about beginners after all - right?

Edited by PathWalker
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9 hours ago, Raggydoll said:

Yes. Very true. Maybe we should make another thread that is simply called TdM for Beginners. It could have tips on books, decks, symbolism, reading styles, things to be aware of etc. Basically all the good stuff would be gathered there, with links to resources etc. And I could make it a sticky.. Just a suggestion! 

I would love that! Just stumbled into TdM through a you-tube episode from Tarot Maps who showed the Dodal Tarot and became hooked. Now i’m Absorbing everything i find about TdM. So everything related for newbies, i would be Soo grateful!!! 

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@TheBabeliteI hope you really enjoy your CBD deck! It's the one I keep in my work bag pretty much all the time. I love the faces on it, and like you said, its price point is solid, so if it ever needs replacing, it won't break the bank (as long as it stays affordable).

 

@Saturn CelesteRe: the 1JJ Swiss: this deck can be expensive, but Amazon's prices are a bit inflated. I'd recommend lurking on eBay if you're looking for another copy. Right now there are a couple from US sellers in the $25 - $30 range (including shipping). I'd recommend varying your keyword search too. I had good luck looking by "Vintage Tarot Game" and found the US Games Kit with a 1JJ, the spread sheet, book, and LWB for a great price (which is why I now have two copies of said kit 🙂 ). There are a couple of sellers from Lithuania that sell English-language versions for around USD20, but I'm not sure if they are legit copies or what. I also found a good price on a site called Mercari. It's a smaller version of eBay, and doesn't have quite the selection, but if you're in the US, it might also be worth keeping an eye on.

 

Oh, and @Raggydollthank you for creating that learning thread! I'm kind of in love with TdM and TdM-style decks, and am looking forward to discussions on it 🙂 

Edited by HermitWriter
To thank Raggydoll!
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Just jumping back in here bc I just found I had the LoS Burdel mini.  The re-colored one w all the gorgeous red.  It has the limited color palette of cardinal colors and green.  I'm wondering if that would do as a starters deck for TdM?  I really prefer looking at it to the Ancien, at least the newer and less expensive one being prescribed.  I also have the Pierre Madenie deck.  

 

ETA:  That LoS Burdel TdM deck I mentioned above has the annoying "habit" of translating some of the suits "magically":  the coins "pentacles", the bastons "wands"; and the Papesse as "High Priestess", the Pope as "Hierophant"..... for the English speakers.  I remember someone here already mentioning this phenomenon. 

Edited by bastetly
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On 11/21/2019 at 5:27 AM, Raggydoll said:

Totally. That goes for every type of deck. But I believe that some people get intimidated by the thought of having to rely on their own impressions and so they rather have keywords memorized. 

I have to (respectfully!) disagree.
Numbers mean things. Suits mean things.
Some keywords are in order. You can go from there and look at color pooling, cut flowers and what-have-you, and it can  get a bit loosey-goosey, but impressions, AFAIC, should always be checked against number and suit. If they fit, great. If not, toss them.
The Tarot - especially TdM - is a deck of playing cards. And there is a method there. You do you, but this is what I've found to work - and I've run the gamut on this thing. PC methods are the way to go for accuracy, IMHO.

It's not a matter of being intimidated. It's a matter of not being led down the primrose path by Brain.
Brain is an a-hole. https://theoatmeal.com/comics/brain

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But anyway, as far as decks go, nothing beats Yves.
I ran the gamut from Tarot Classic to Grimaud to Noblet to Heron to Jodo/Camoin to yadda yadda. But I got a Madenie some years back, the one with the shadow images, and I STOPPED. That's my TdM.
The shadow images have since been cleaned up, but it's still a pretty fine TdM. https://tarot-de-marseille-heritage.com/english/catalogue_madenie1709.html
 

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